Comments on: When Good Things Happen Through Bad People

By: David Esdaile

David Esdaile — Sat, 01 Jun 2019 11:34:03 +0000

I want to say that you’re exaggerating, that you’re tarnishing the reputations of great leaders, but even my own experience teaches me that God uses “ungodly” people. Maybe the highest good is to honour God and “hallow” his name, despite our human frailty or even grotesque sin. The one who was justified in the temple was the tax collector who could only cry, “Have mercy on me, a sinner”. A profound paradox is that the sovereign, holy God uses those who make themselves available to achieve his purposes, despite their “unworthiness”. That gives me hope.

By: Janette

Janette — Fri, 31 May 2019 22:13:38 +0000

God once used a donkey to do his will. And he sent a prophetic word through the high priest who was heading up the kangaroo court that convicted Jesus. The prophets say that God sent King Nebuchadnezzar to conquer God’s people. God can and might use anyone.
That is not to say that the sinful person used by God will somehow “get away with it”. Jesus did say that anyone who causes a little child to stumble (ahem, slaveholders and also those separating families) would be better off with a millstone around their neck, at the bottom of the sea. Back when I was a kid, people used to say “Life is short; eternity is long.”
That’s the only way that I can try to make sense of this kind of conundrum. If God waited to use perfect people, he wouldn’t find anyone. On the other hand, God doesn’t overlook the harm done to “the least of these.” We will all give an account, for both the good and the bad that we’ve done. And there is coming a day when God will right every wrong and dry every tear, including those caused by people who claimed to be acting in his name.
Maybe more than anything this is a reminder not to hero worship or to hate people, as though they are either all good or all bad.

By: Christine Mavlian

Christine Mavlian — Thu, 30 May 2019 22:32:31 +0000

In reply to Mary Fisher. Me too Mary. I'm having a hard time with this.

By: Gary Bradley

Gary Bradley — Thu, 30 May 2019 19:08:15 +0000

Michael and et al
As I read this blog i find comfort in sharing these views. As it regards the question. does God give good things to bad people ? i have a reccomendation. i’m currently reading Peter Enns’ new book “How the Bible Actually Works”. for those who read this i suspect you will love or hate it i’ll let you find out why. But for me it was , dare I say life changing? well maybe but for sure it has taken me to a new level of Biblical understanding

By: Peter Bowyer

Peter Bowyer — Thu, 30 May 2019 12:08:18 +0000

In reply to Mary Fisher.

As Mary said, you always make me think. But never more than in this article. I squirm to admit that I agree. I don’t want to … but I have to. As grace grows in me more and more with time, this type of challenge to my gospel understanding finds a deeper place within. How great is God. Thank you Mike … very much. You’re a straight shooter.

By: Joshua Goss

Joshua Goss — Thu, 30 May 2019 10:48:43 +0000

In reply to Michael Frost. Just good quality stuff all round. Loved it. And this comment by Merv and then your comment back. I'm loving it all.

By: Mary Fisher

Mary Fisher — Thu, 30 May 2019 05:39:45 +0000

Mike

I really struggled with this article.

I know it is solid theology but but but…

As I read something within me screams at the injustice that occurs in such situations where powerful Christians dehumanise others while being acclaimed in positions of status and power. I won’t call them followers of Jesus because it seems to me that is not who they are.

Genesis 1-11 compared with other Ancient Near East creation narratives challenges us to never be dehumanising status seekers.

And it goes on and on through church history. status and position are sought and victims lie scattered around.

Christendom has left countless victims scattered and we continue to see this.

And with Imperialism and the Industrial Revolution continuing hand in glove, China now leads the West in dehumanising work and exploitation which feeds our “Consumer Gods” and we are pretty silent. We critique China but do not understand in feeding their avarice we are them. We do not ask people to consider what they buy.

That avarice trend along with Climate Change wars are leaving so many more victims with Christian persons in power positions so blind to what is happening.

Climate Change already is mocking our -the church’s – preparedness to be silent in the pulpit about where the greed for status, position and stuff leads us. To use a metaphor from Proverbs we are like pigs being led by a rope through a ring in our nostrils.

Sorry to rave on Mike but as part of the pietist tradition I wonder what it means to follow “in the way of Jesus” putting off the “old Person” and putting on the “new Person” in the face of the Christian Church leaving victims all over the public Square.

Incarnation, Jesus Baptism and Temptation, his Miracles and Kingdom Parables, his Temple Cleansing, his Crucifixion, Resurrection, Ascension and Pentecost herald a new hinge in history where we are to follow in the way of the last Adam who gives the life giving Spirit.

So while I admit your blog reflects theology that is true I scream out against such theology removed from the larger Gospel narrative for Jesus leads us into life in a cruciform shaped community living out what New Creation looks like.

Thanks for blogging – you and Hauerwas always make me think .

By: Dave Berlach

Dave Berlach — Thu, 30 May 2019 04:15:13 +0000

Fantastic article Mike! Thanks.

By: Michael Frost

Michael Frost — Thu, 30 May 2019 03:44:49 +0000

In reply to Merv Olsen. I concede that point. I guess I was getting at her complicity in an unjust system, but you're right that she probably had very little agency in the matter.

By: Merv Olsen

Merv Olsen — Thu, 30 May 2019 02:36:42 +0000

A well balanced article indeed Mike.

However, I was a little surprised to see Queen Esther listed as sinning – I thought she had no choice in the matter of pleasing the king!