A tale of two Christianities on its knees

They’re both Christian footballers and they’re both known for kneeling on the field, although for very different reasons.

One grew up the son of Baptist missionaries to the Philippines. The other was baptized Methodist, confirmed Lutheran, and attended a Baptist church during college.

Both have made a public display of their faith. Both are prayerful and devout.

This is the tale of two Christian sports personalities, one of whom is the darling of the American church while the other is reviled. And their differences reveal much about the brand of Christianity preferred by many in the church today.

 

First up, there’s Tim Tebow.

Tebow was homeschooled by his Christian parents, and spent his summers in the Philippines, helping with his father’s orphanage and missionary work.

During his college football career, the Heisman Trophy winner frequently wore references to Bible verses on his eye black, including the ubiquitous John 3:16 during the 2009 BCS Championship Game.

He has been outspoken about his pro-life stance, and his commitment to abstinence from sex before marriage.

He is a prominent member of the Fellowship of Christian Athletes, an organization which insists that leaders sign a Statement of Sexual Purity, stating that sex outside marriage and homosexual acts are unacceptable to God.

He has preached in churches, prisons, schools, youth groups, and a welter of evangelical conferences.

And he is well known for his signature move – dropping to one knee on the field, his head bowed in prayer, his arm resting on his bent knee – known throughout the world as Tebowing.

He’s clean cut, polite, gentle, respectful.

 

Then, there’s Colin Kaepernick.

Kaepernick, until recently the San Francisco 49ers quarterback, was born to a 19-year-old, single, white woman. His black father had left the picture before Colin was born. His mother was destitute and gave him up for adoption. He was raised by the Kaepernicks, a white couple from Milwaukee.

His body is festooned with religious tattoos, including depictions of scrolls, a cross, praying hands, angels defeating demons, terms like “To God be the Glory”, “Heaven Sent”, “God will guide me”, Psalm 18:39 and Psalm 27:3.

He has said of his faith,

“My faith is the basis from where my game comes from. I’ve been very blessed to have the talent to play the game that I do and be successful at it. I think God guides me through every day and helps me take the right steps and has helped me to get to where I’m at. When I step on the field, I always say a prayer, say I am thankful to be able to wake up that morning and go out there and try to glorify the Lord with what I do on the field. I think if you go out and try to do that, no matter what you do on the field, you can be happy about what you did.”

And Kaepernick’s faith isn’t just about making him feel happy. It’s turned him into an activist and philanthropist.

This year, during the offseason Kaepernick launched a GoFundMe page to fly food and water into suffering Somalia. It surpassed its $2 million goal in just four days. In March, the plane loaded with essential supplies landed in Mogadishu.

He had already pledged to donate $1 million, along with the proceeds of his jersey sales from the 2016 season, to charitable work.

Recently, Meals on Wheels announced it had received $50,000 from Kaepernick.

Last week, he joined with the charitable organization 100 Suits, to pass out free suits in front of the New York State Parole office for people who have been released from prison and are looking for jobs.

But we all know why Colin Kaepernick is most famous.

Beginning in 2016, he refused to stand to attention during the playing of the American national anthem.

Kaepernick decided to either remain seated or kneel during on field renditions of the Star Spangled Banner in support of Black Lives Matter and in protest against police violence against black people. He explains,

“I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color. To me, this is bigger than football and it would be selfish on my part to look the other way. There are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder.”

He vowed to continue to protest until he feels like “[the American flag] represents what it’s supposed to represent.”

You know what happened next, right?

Kaepernick was voted the “most disliked” player in the NFL.

People posted videos of them burning his jerseys.

He was called “an embarrassment” and “a traitor”.

He was blamed for a significant drop in NFL television ratings, with fans boycotting the NFL because of his protest.

He received death threats.

 

Then, there’s Christianity on its knees.

It seems to me that Tim Tebow and Colin Kaepernick represent the two very different forms that American Christianity has come to.

And not just in America. In many parts of the world it feels as though the church is separating into two versions, one that values personal piety, gentleness, respect for cultural mores, and an emphasis on moral issues like abortion and homosexuality, and another that values social justice, community development, racial reconciliation, and political activism.

One version is kneeling in private prayer. The other is kneeling in public protest.

One is concerned with private sins like abortion. The other is concerned with public sins like racial discrimination.

One preaches a gospel of personal salvation. The other preaches a gospel of political and social transformation.

One is reading the Epistles of Paul. The other is reading the Minor Prophets.

One is listening to Eric Metaxas and Franklin Graham. The other is listening to William Barber and John Perkins.

One is rallying at the March for Life. The other is getting arrested at Moral Monday protests.

You can see where this is going. The bifurcation of contemporary Christianity into two distinct branches is leaving the church all the poorer, with each side needing to be enriched by the biblical vision of the other.

Biblical Christianity should be, as Walter Brueggemann expresses it, “awed to heaven, rooted in earth.” We should, as he says, be able to both “join the angels in praise, and keep our feet in time and place.”

Sadly, with the suspicion and animosity shown toward each side of the divide by the other I can’t see a coming together any time soon.

In the meantime, Christianity remains on its knees in the West.

 

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The views expressed are my own and do not necessarily represent the official views of Morling College or its affiliates and partners.

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225 thoughts on “A tale of two Christianities on its knees

  1. I believe articles like this are a larger part of the problem. You have stereotyped and made caricatures of the individuals and values indicated.
    “My” christians are concerned for all the issues espoused. There is no either/or choice for these values. It is a false dichotomy.
    I also take particular exception to the notion that the USA as a nation fosters oppression and racial division. Read the Constitution and Amendments. There ARE individuals and groups that are guilty of these things but they are not the nation’s values. I also reject the disrespect shown by Kaepernick. It is reverse racism and bigotry to accuse all whites of guilt.
    Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

    1. That was the very point I was making. Christians should be concerned with all the values I espoused. To separate them is a false dichotomy. Did you stop reading before the end?

      1. As for Kaepernick’s protest, isn’t the right to free speech an entrenched American value?

        1. He has the right to free speech. Larry Flint has the right to free speech. Free speech includes the right to say racist and bigotted things – as BLM and Collin Kaepernick have done. That does not mean that any Christians should agree with him, or say that what he does is not disrespectfurl (it is VERY disrespectful).

          1. Some might find it very disrespectful to sing a song written by a slave owner who believed blacks to be “a distinct and inferior race of people, which all experience proves to be the greatest evil that afflicts a community.” A song which in its third verse celebrates American victory over freed slaves fighting with the British. I stand during the national anthem, but I am certainly not offended by those who peacefully protest the real inequalities that exist in our country by not standing. I don’t believe peaceful protest is disrespectful. I believe it is AMERICAN.

          2. Point of reference for Brad. The third verse is not about escaped slaves being defeated while fighting for the British. It speaks to the practice of the British Navy to capture American sailors and forceing them to serve on Royal Navy Ships. In fact, it grew to such a major issue it was one of the main issues that led to the war of 1812. Impressment was the slavery of the seas.

          3. Here’s the problem. Too many people are completely blind to the fact that there is a very big racial problem in America. It’s not everyone, but there are definitely cultural systems in place that create an idea that people of color are automatically predisposed to do wrong with few exceptions. Where as non-color people are presumed to automatically be in the right even when they are not. To prove my point all you have to do is google “three white teens” and then google “three black teens” and you will see very different pictures of what comes up. So how do you start the conversation to make change happen and create the environment to healthy and equal living? And how do you do it without violence, without yelling and being angry, etc? You make a simple gesture that sounds an alarm to ask the question “why is he doing that? Let’s listen in on the whys. Maybe there is a point to this.” What Abraham Lincoln did was considered “disrespectful”. what Martin Luther King was considered “disrespectful”. Jesus himself was “disrespectful” to the religious and pias leaders of the time. And yet he gives us a clear picture of what it means to stand in the gap and give dignity to those looked down on when he met the woman at the well on Samaria. If you know your history, you know that Samria was a mixed race country that religious leaders would make sure to walk around so they wouldn’t have to deal with them: they were, in fact, the outcast people. Jesus makes an intentional gesture into there and does something VERY disrespectful….he take to a Samaritan woman there. And he restores her value and dignity while there. Amazing!

            Peaceful gestures that cause people to look in the mirror have always been the best way to change. So when you say it was “disrespectful”, I say “you’re just not listening,” hence, you’re part of the problem not the solution.

          4. Completely agree, Richard.
            Thank you for your comment!

          5. I find it quite disturbing you refuse to see the double standard…he’s a good man…it’s that simple

          6. Early Christian were thought to be ‘disrespectful’ to the Roman Empire.

          7. This is the FIRST time I have ever heard of any supposed Christian faith on Kaepernick’s part. Besides his support of BLM (most definitely NOT a Christian group), he is apparently dating a Muslim woman, which might explain some of his anti-American actions or comments. These 2 items seem to belie his “Christian” faith….

          8. On the other hand, I’ve heard about his faith plenty of times before this.

            And Black Lives Matter is neither a Christian nor a Non-Christian group, so I’m not sure why that’s noteworthy (although I know Christians who support it).

          9. Are you more worried about respect or disrespect or the very PEOPlE who are affected by the discrimination going on? Jesus made it very clear who He sided with and it wasn’t the religious group, it was those who were oppressed. It takes a lot more guts to side with the disadvantaged! He put Himself in their shoes and always responded to “authentic ” faith.

          10. I do not see the Black Lives Matter movement and Colin Kaepernick’s kneel as racist and bigotted. I do not even see these things as disrespectful. See, what you have said is we have the right to free speech as long as it is pleasing to your viewpoint. Try opening your mind and your heart just a little.

          11. So true. Colin is very blessed to have played NFL FOOTBALL. Americans just want to watch the game. They do not want to see their political views on the field. These players represent the national football league & need to honor their owner/employer. They have many opportunities to speak their political views.

        2. Here here!
          I look to Dietrich Bonhoeffer and the courage he showed with the actions he took, that ultimately led him to his death. You should look him up, perhaps read “Discipleship,” to start, his “Letters and Papers from Prison,” and “Ethics” and you’ll see why I cited his example.
          Kaepernick has a right to speak his mind. As Americans we have the right to agree or disagree. I personally agree with him. Everyone is created and valued by God. My Christian convictions tell me that this is true. My race has no superiority over another. The reality of White privilege exists whether we want to admit it or not. I think that is what he is talking and protesting about. The overt and subtile…one we see and one we don’t necessarily see. Kaepernick is standing for equality and justice much like Bonhoeffer fought to save the Gospel and people’s lives.

          1. Interesting- you mention “white privilege”. I don’t deny it exists, though in a really watered down way compared to a hundred years ago… Here’s what “white Privilege” got Tim Tebow in the NFL – cut 4 times and now minor league baseball…Kap – multi multi million dollar contract with essentially the same throwing motion as Tebow…. I could care less what either makes and it doesn’t bother me…just ridiculously using terms like “white privilege ” when it doesn’t apply – simply waters it down more…

          2. Some say not only do we have a right, but rather a call. Kap…is bold and faithful…keep on preaching with your life – from your knees or the sidelines (sadly.)

        3. Absolutely the right to protest is upheld in our Constitution!

          1. Tebow kneels NOT during the Nat Anthem Kaep of course does. Kaep is praised Tebow hated. Liberals are in control of NFL through black lib player saturation 85%. Blacks welcome abortion 24/7. Tebow opposes it, life sacred. not to the blacks though. All blacks 95% liberals. Tricked into liberalism with freebies galore since 1964.
            Hence, injustice to TEBOW not Kaep.

        4. So it is acceptable for one group to exercise that right, but not another? It seems someone will be offended regardless of the motives or cause of the protestors. Where do we draw the line? Indeed, should we?

        5. The 1st Amendment does not provide for free speech in the workplace which is where these protests are taking place. NFL owners have rules against many expressions of speech that they believe disrupt the experience of the fan.

        6. It is quite compelling that you do not see what really matters in the end. How far are you willing to go to see the truth. Glorifying to Persecution isn’t that the way Jesus showed us.

        7. That’s not the point Mike, all the supporters of KAepernick don’t get it. It’s not right to disrespect the flag, the military and veterans, especially while being a role model and while on the job. There are many other ways to show his first amendment right rant. Trust me Mike, KAepernick is no Tim Tebow.

        8. It is just not the right venue, as it was not the right venue in the 1968 Olympics when the two black American athletes protested on the award stand. It’s just not the right place.

        9. And Jesus demonstrated lifting up the down trodden, and forgiveness!

        10. Free speech is only for universities, BLM protests, and the media that supports them. All others are not allowed or shouted down

        11. Yes, just as it is the right of an employer to replace employees with those who are 100% focused on the job that they’re paid to do.

        12. Yes. But so is the right to endure the consequences of their free speech. Athletes and actors are paid entertainers for the masses. When they stray into personal politics they must be prepared for the backwashing from those their politics offend.
          The dichotomy of Christianity you described is actually the difference between spiritual battle and a temporal battle. Change a man’s heart and you can change his politics. The reverse isn’t possible. No one will ever make it to heaven because the marches in a BLM parade. They would do better to read the ubiquitous John 3:16.

      2. Jesus + nothing = Everything. Don’t add anything else to the gospel Jesus preached to suit your liking. No one knows Collin’s heart. We don’t know where Christ is in his life. Religious tattoos don’t validate your faith. Same goes for Tebow. But your article suggest Tebow is not interested in social justice. I think you need to take a closer look at Tebow’s life, and his close personal friends (Lecrae, Trip Lee) and what they stand for. I personally used to like Collin, and I value what he is trying to bring to light, but he’s completly lost in how he’s trying to send that message. I mean he came out wearing a Fidel Castro shirt and followed it up with a Malcolm X shirt. Followers of Christ can’t get caught up in that kind of mess.

        1. Kap has the courage to draw attention to himself to further the conversation of equal justice for all Americans. If wearing a provocative shirt or socks gets it done, then that’s his method. Notice how despite the pain to himself and his career, he has not backed down. He put himself in harm’s way, to the point of risking being killed, to draw attention to what should be an important issue to all Americans.

      3. Mr. Frost,
        What “Christian values” were you showing when publishing (in a nationally known publication) an obviously slanted article? In describing one player, you extol not only his many personal achievements and religious values, but his plethora of philanthropic achievements. And the other? His personal achievements and religious values, but No mention that his foundation supports and cares for orphans in several countries, and hosts a “prom night” for tens of thousands of special needs kids, and grants wishes to dying children, and gives support to families adopting children with special needs, and has built a hospital for the destitute people of the Philippines, and, well, I think I’ve made my point. Why did you choose to omit this information? Praising one man while making the other appear selfish does not, itself, seem very “Christian.” Rather, it inflames the current, and unfortunate, state of racial tension plaguing the country, further deepening the divide, and does so under the guise of uniting Christianity.

        1. And in addition fails to point out the NFL was highly critical of Tebow for his private non-disruptive faith expression and embraces Kaps disruption even though the NFL rules clearly articulate how the players and anthem and flag interact and Jesus instructed us to live at peace with all men and in submission to those who rule over us.

      4. Dear Author,
        It is nearly impossible to take your article as a credible read when you fail to use positive adoption language.
        Please take time to educate yourself and others when your word is out there for many vulnerable eyes and minds.
        His brave and selfless Birth Mother did not “give him up for adoption”.
        She made a choice to put the best interests of her son ahead of her own needs, wants, desires, heart, and motherly instincts to PLACE HIM with an Adoptive Family.

      5. But you did separate them, creating a false dichotomy. You never mentioned The Tim Tebow Foundation and what it does for children’s hospitals around the world, for instance. You never mentioned how Franklin Graham’s Samaritan’s Purse is doing more for Syrian refugees in Greece than any other Christian organization, for instance. Biased articles like these only serve to foster such bifurcation. The apostle James rightly said that pure religion is caring for orphans and widows, AND keeping oneself unspotted from the world.

        1. Did you read the whole article? Clearly the dichotomy is one established in America’s churches… The author’s calling for reconciliation of those ‘opposing’ views. Satan seeks to divide.

      6. There is nothing more racist than abortion. It kills 50% of Africa American people, 33% of Hispanics and only 25% of whites.

      7. Mike Frost, obviously you did your research about the charitable giving of Kaepernick, you did nothing about the charitable giving of Teebow. This I call a lie by silence. Why did you not include that in your article. I haven’t researched to call one over the other but you certainly should have. Also you present the taking the knee as equal, I consider it vastly different that one did it during the playing of the national anthem; the other did it on the sideline before the game. I don’t think it was ever done during the playing of the national anthem. Two very deliberate and important omissions you have made. If they were not deliberate, you do not deserve your reputation to casually leave out such important details.

      8. Most Christians would never distinguish like this. It is totally inaccurate though interesting take. First of all C.K. is not a Christian and he is not taking a knee to show respect. In the quote you used he stated his purpose was to disrespect the flag of a country that has inequality. Those are not the same. He is disrespecting the country. Also Tebow did not kneel during the anthem, he kneeled as an allowable celebration in the game. C.K. is not respecting anyone, he stated his purpose is to disrespect and he began being bitter and angry after dating his Muslim girlfriend who has obviously filled his head with anti-American propaganda since he was fine and even played great football until he was basically infiltrated. That should not fall on the rest of the country to deal with. He could have dealt with his problems on his own time. For me this article is more about shaming. Shaming is the rule of the day. Everyone is always appealing to people’s sense of morality. People should not be shamed into feeling bad about what they clearly see for themselves. We have to continue to use our minds, hearts, God’s word and prayer to stay faithful to what is right. We need to stay humble, but not be swayed by shaming. We cannot take to heart being called a racist, but if we see prejudice in our lives be humble and repent to God and change, not get on political bandwagons to appease the culture.

      9. The differences between these two men are not differences in their Christianity, but differences of culture. Both see the need to draw attention to their faith (evangelize); Tebow did that by bending his knee (showing his allegiance to God first, then country) and Kaepernick has many religious tattoos, both use interviews to express their faith. Both are charitable–a Christian virtue. But how are they charitable? I don’t have a list of their charities, but being a product of the white Christian culture myself I would expect that Tebow’s charities lean toward missionary work, help that always includes evangelism. Kaepernick comes out of the black social justice tradition that gives aid without strings and works to lift the poor out of poverty.

        Another interesting difference is that a large number of white Christians think America is a Christian nation ( my mother included), and therefore any disrespect to country is interpreted as disrespect to God. People of color love America the same as the white folk, but they are fighting to make our secular democracy a little more democratic. Kaepernick kneeled because he felt it was his moral Christian obligation to bring attention to the issue of racism in this country and he succeeded mightily.

        1. Thank you!
          Their kneeling is done out of respect. Just as players kneel when another player is injured out of respect. It was a millitary veteran that advised Kap to stop sitting on the bench but instead kneel. Neither of these men protests have anything to do with the flag. It’s just easier to attack and villainize Kap over the flag than it is to admit there is a serious problem STILL in regards to racial inequality in this.country. I respect BOTH of them and support their right to kneel.

          If Nazi confederate flag holding idiots can express themselves freely and often NOT peacefully, explain why they can’t peacefully protest? Double standard one of the reasons Kap is kneeling.

          All of these MASS SHOOTERS are peacefully apprehended after killing people and some still with weapons. Yet people of color are being sometimes illegally detained at alarming rates and mysteriously murdered. So the police don’t fear for their lives with mass shooters just people of color. This is why he kneels NOT the made up reason associated with the flag. I will continue to boycott the NFL.

      10. Colin is no longer a Christian. Kapernick converted to Islam. Tebow has been mocked and gotten a lot of grief because of his Christian values. Colin suffers from what Leftists PC call #WhitePriviledge. Free speech does not guarantee a positive reaction; besides Colin was at work when he protested. Companies have rules and regulations for employees. Colin can protest all he wants to, just not on the job or there are consequences.

    2. Being an outside observer I have often wondered at the reverence Americans have for their flag. It seems to me that Love of God may come second to love of their country.

      I might be wrong but that is just my observation.

      As for my beliefs, I am firmly planted in both camps. I believe that we, as the church, need to publicly advocate for both personal salvation and also for social justice. Jesus certainly did.

      1. Jesus offered grace, mercy, and forgiveness, not Social Justice.

        1. Taylor, the truth of the Gospel is not divorced from work of the Gospel (social justice). Read the Gospel of Luke carefully. The whole theme is God’s redemptive mercy on the outcasts as being the good news. Your false dichotomy was pretty much the whole point of this article – and you totally missed it.

          1. I offered no false dichotomy.

            Social Justice, has currently used, is a political term used to sidestep actual Justice and is synonymous with socialistic Governmental forced redistribution.

            While I agree, the work of the gospel was for people, often disenfranchised and truly was Good News, the Gospel was never connected to a Government, a program, a tax, or any other mandatory legal prescription.

            I suggest reading Friedrich Hayek “The Mirage of Social Justice”

          2. Chapter 23 The Screwtape Letters – C.S. Lewis (1942)

            (A demon talking about the “virtue” of social justice)

            NOTE: “The Enemy” is what Screwtape calls Jesus

            About the general connection between Christianity and politics, our position is more delicate. Certainly, we do not want men to allow their Christianity to flow over into their political life, for the establishment of anything like a really just society would be a major disaster. On the other hand we do want, and want very much, to make men treat Christianity as a means; preferably, of course, as a means to their own advancement, but, failing that, as a means to anything—even to social justice. The thing to do is to get a man at first to value social justice as a thing which the Enemy demands, and then work him on to the stage at which he values Christianity because it may produce social justice. For the Enemy will not be used as a convenience. Men or nations who think they can revive the Faith to make a good society might just as well think they can use the stairs of Heaven as a short cut to the nearest chemist’s shop. Fortunately, it is quite easy to coax humans round this little corner. Only today I have found a passage in a Christian writer where he recommends his own version of Christianity on the ground that “only such a faith can outlast the death of old cultures and the birth of new civilizations.” You see the little rift? “Believe this, not because it is true, but for some other reason.” That’s the game,

            Your affectionate uncle
            SCREWTAPE

          3. “Government redistribution” is just one possible way to try to achieve social justice – one that many proponents of social justice disagree with.

            One person might think diplomacy is the best way to stop North Korea from using a nuke. Someone else might think nuclear deterrence is the best way. Just because people disagree on the methods doesn’t mean they have a different end goal.

            Social Justice is the end goal. It also includes eliminating racism, sexism, and other civil rights issues.

          4. We need to remember that the Mosaic teaching advocates redistribution of property-ie wealth. This is not socialism in the Marxist sense, but we can be sure that any scriptural approach to politics must included provision for the powerless,poor and disenfranchised and a critical but hopeful stance to nationalism and government. One thing for sure is the Bible is definitely not capitalist or could care less for a flag or an anthem.

          5. Gary:
            The redistribution we see in Acts 2 was a VOLUNTEER giving of “wealth” to help those in need within their OWN group of believers. They didn’t feed everybody, just their own church.

            But Peter said, “Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the price of the land for yourself? 4 While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control? Why have you conceived this thing in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God.”

            Peter clearly believes in property ownership, and their right to control the money from the sale. (free market) It was THEIR money. He is angry that they lied about the price and their giving, not about the amount.

            But are correct about Capitalism, however, Jesus is about FREEDOM and Socialism is anything but.

          6. Joel, what do we gain by adding Social to Justice?
            Why is Justice not sufficient?

            God is Just, does He need to be Socially Just too?

            Does added Political to Correctness make Correctness more correct or less correct?

          7. Social justice is, by many definitions, just a subcategory of justice. It’s not that “justice” is insufficient, it’s that Social justice is more specific about what you’re referring to. It would be like asking why someone says they’re a defense attorney rather than just say they’re an attorney – it’s more specific.

            Political Correctness seems to be a bit of a misnomer. It’s mostly just an attempt to avoid being a jerk (which is separate from being factually right or wrong). It’s not factually wrong to call a Chinese person a Chink. It’s just generally obnoxious and counterproductive.

          8. Some comments here about redistribution. That is not governmental. Believers are to help others. It speaks of primarily supporting family members who are unable to support themselves, mostly old widows and orphans. It does not talk about supporting others full time, but as needed help the poor. It is not mean to be a welfare system and for those who think they are generous because they think the government should support entire large families ect. You are off base. Proverbs says if a man does not work, he should not eat and condemns laziness. Now maybe we should do what the bible says and start taking care of our family members who actually cannot work or need temporary help. It would be a lot cheaper than raising taxes and there’d be less fraud.

        2. Taylor, what exactly is your definition of “social justice”?

          1. Great Question

            The addition of “Social” is an unnecessary addition to the word Justice and causes “Justice” to take a backseat to “Social.”

            Consider the word “Correct” it means to have the right answer. Now add “Political” in front, and the term changes to mean (what the politic deems IS correct or acceptable.) Similar to Orwell’s NewSpeak and the Managment of Big Brother, we must see “Correctness” through the prism of “Political.” Meaning the word Correct is no longer used in a quest for accuracy, but what a Political authority says is True.

            “Politically correct” was initially coined by Leon Trotsky to refer favorably to those whose views remained in sync with the ever-shifting Bolshevik Party line (Russia). This was important, as the “not PC” people risked prison or death. So much for free speech.

            “Politically correct” was revived (and again, used favorably) by 1960s New Left radicals who fancied themselves revolutionaries in the mold of Che, Castro, and Mao.

            Social and Political are replacement words for “Group.” Group Justice and Group Correctness. This is Collectivist speak and profoundly part of a Leftist value system that is intended to silence both Justices and Correctness.

            ———————-

            What I think you are after is Grace and Mercy, not “Social” Justice. Together these two Gifts allow one to show empathy, to show Love. Grace and Mercy enable us to give to someone in need, to show kindness to our enemies, to forgive or pay other’s debts and to stay by the person who fails. Grace and Mercy are the means to bypass the sometimes harsh judgments of Justice. Grace and Mercy is how God helps us avoid the terrible Justice of His own judgment.

            There is good reason Justice is blindfolded. A blind Justice is required for Equality under the law. When Justice is peeking, there is cheating, and being good at “Social” Justice requires no blindfold at all.

          2. Taylor, social justice include thing like why is the levies to prevent flooding only built in the white side of town and not the black side? Why is the city dump always placed on the black side of town? Why is the big company allowed to pass the cost of building their factory/stadium/big box store on to tax payers, but you have to pay to have your street fixed leading to your small business?
            I think you are confusing social justice and socialism.

        3. Taylor, you need to read the gospels again. If you don’t have time for that just read the beatitudes in Matthew or in Luke. Jesus challenged the systems of power of his time, and accepted all the marginalized people (sinners, women, tax collectors, poor people, sick people, and just about everyone who was excluded from polite society) in his ministry and promised them forgiveness and a place in God’s kingdom. He told people who were wealthy to share with those who are needy. If that’s not social justice, I don’t know what is.

          1. Jesus accepted the marginalized people because the people He came for rejected Him. (The Wedding Feast parable)

            The whole point of the Gospel or Good News is that it gives us a way to live IN SPITE of Government and Culture. It is not a prescription on how we should expect our government to function.

            1. Jesus intentionally showed no interest in Government.

            2. Jesus never created a social program, influenced a government law, nor did he use Government resources or power.

            3. Jesus never advocated for the collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods, NEVER! This IS the definition of Socialism.

            4. Jesus never defined Charity as ME giving YOUR money to someone else.

            5. The very word Entitlement removes any notion of Charity, Giving, or Kindness by both the supplier and receiver of the money.

            6. Jesus never advocated for a governing middleman, nor a politician who benefits from the money he takes and the money he gives.

            7. Jesus said, “But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing,” This is impossible in a system that mandates you give.

            8. Paul said, “Each of you should give what you have decided in your heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.” Also impossible in a system that mandates you give.

            9. Paul says the love of money is the root of all kinds of evil. Greed doesn’t go away in Socialism; it merely redefines who’s greed is acceptable and reasonable, that being the Governments and the “Entitled” or preferred Recipient. The creator of the wealth being the only one labeled as greedy.

            10. Anyone who believes that socialist redistribution of wealth is in anyway Christ “like” charity, can supply me with access to your bank accounts, and I will gladly give away your money in the name of Jesus.

            BONUS: Jesus never protested, marched, organized dissent, unionized or fought the system. He merely offered His way and let people FREELY choose to participate or not. Which is the antithesis of the compulsory core of Socialism?

          2. I’d add the word Agape (God’s Love) is better translated as Charity. When you feed the poor, you are showing Charity or God’s Love not Social Justice.

            Justice is the result of Law, a finding by a judge. Jesus didn’t come to “condemn” (judge) the world but to save it.
            Justice would have meant our death as we are all guilty under His Law.

            BUT there is Good News! 🙂

            Jesus offered us Charity (Agape Love) which consists of Forgiveness: (The removal of debts.)
            Grace: (getting what we DON’T deserve)
            Mercy: (NOT getting what we DO deserve)

            The mixing of Grace and Mercy are how we avoid the Justice of His righteous Judgment.

            Personally, I prefer to offer those in need Grace and Mercy. I have no desire to play judge dispensing Justice, social or otherwise.

          3. It is applied Grace and Mercy to society!

          4. If Christians actually did what we were called to do, we wouldn’t need government assistance. But churches, and Christians, aren’t actually caring for the poor around them. So I’m fine taking money from all and giving to those in need if people, individually, won’t do it. And I don’t see this as “justifying” my lack of generosity. What I take home, post-taxes, is mine to give with generously. Christians who use taxation as an excuse for a lack of generosity do not understand that generosity is not about net income or the number after the dollar sign… it is a heart posture.

          5. Taylor’s comment below yours, Susan, is about a clear an analysis as I’ve read in a long time. Couldn’t agree more.

          6. Bri

            Forced giving removes Charity (Agape Love) from the equation and drives a deeper wedge between the giver and the receiver, which, I believe, is precisely the objective. No relationship is made in an entitlement transaction and creating an entitlement mindset in a person is the antithesis to Christianity’s notion of GRACE. (A gift we don’t deserve)

            The Government wants to be “god” provider. It wants to be believed in, trusted and the go to.

            I HIGHLY recommend reading Against Empathy.
            https://www.amazon.com/Against-Empathy-Case-Rational-Compassion/dp/0062339338

          7. “Forced giving” may not have the agape that charitable giving has, but “forced giving” doesn’t prevent charitable giving, so it seems like a moot point. And where do you get the idea that it drives a deeper wedge between giver and receiver?

            For all this talk of ‘entitlement’, I think most of the evidence I’ve seen suggests the opposite. People are ashamed to receive food stamps, and frequently do whatever they can to get out of that situation. People refuse to declare bankruptcy long after experts say they should have done so.
            https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hidden-motives/201510/the-myth-welfare-dependency

          8. Joel,

            My point about “forced giving” is not that I am against taxes, but that our decision to do so is not a Moral one and needs to stop being couched as so, especially by the Christian left. There is ZERO morality in forcing another to give to your cause.

            I’m fine with civil, economic or societal reasons to aid the poor. I’d support some level of aid to merely avoid revolution if need be.

            Here in lies the difference, and it is huge.
            There is no RIGHT to Charity.
            There are RIGHTS to Entitlements.
            We no longer have any SAY over what should be ours.

            ANY Money we give the Government creates POWER. This power may be wielded for a time in a manner you approve, but at some point, it won’t be. I prefer to keep Gov as small as possible and I sure as don’t don’t but my Faith in it.

          9. Taylor,

            This post seems to take a different stance than the one I replied to before.

            Anyway, there are plenty of civil, economic, and societal arguments in favor of these sort of taxes. As far as morality specifically, isn’t almost all taxation effectively “forcing another to give to your cause”? Taxes for public school, for roads, for emergency services, maybe even military – all seem like “your cause” (generic “you” – not you specifically). Also, it seems to me that the most you can argue is that there are conflicting moral principles, and one has to choose how to weight them.

            Is there any right to entitlements? Setting aside programs where people pay into it, and thus have a reasonable expectation from it, it seems to me that any perceived ‘right’ is just because it’s set up to be received under specific conditions, and the person meets those conditions (and has presumably made plans dependent on the funds still being there as long as the conditions continue to be met). That doesn’t seem particularly meaningful, to me.

            If we wanted to, we could create a system to control and limit the power given to the government. To some extent, that system already exists. And frankly, government doing things we want or don’t want is rather independent of what we decide we want them to do with the money now. You’re worried if we allow the government to tax us an extra X percent to help the poor, they could take that X percent and use it for something else later. But they could just tax us that extra X percent anyway, if they wanted. The government could impose a new tax just as easily as they can repurpose a tax that was intended to help poor people.

        4. [16] When Jesus came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up, he went to the synagogue on the sabbath day, as was his custom. He stood up to read, [17] and the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was given to him. He unrolled the scroll and found the place where it was written:
          [18] “The Spirit of the Lord is upon me,
          because he has anointed me
          to bring good news to the poor.
          He has sent me to proclaim release to the captives
          and recovery of sight to the blind,
          to let the oppressed go free,
          [19] to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor.”
          [20] And he rolled up the scroll, gave it back to the attendant, and sat down.

        5. Read “The Judgment of the Nations,” Mt 25; the story of the rich young ruler, Mark 10; read Jesus’ description of his mission in Luke 4 or how he overturned the money tales in the Temple. Jesus was very much about social justice and even emphasized that we will be judged by how much we are about it too.

          1. I am sorry, but the passages you referenced had nothing to do with social justice. Quite the opposite. They, as most of what Jesus taught, were about the kingdom of God and how different it is from the world they lived in, and of course, the world we live in. Jesus had one message, Follow Him in a way totally different from how they were brought up. “Love God and Honor Him by Serving Others”.
            People try to adapt the message to make it look good to the world. The message is the same from before Jesus, but especially since Jesus. Why add modern political terms that can be misconstrued and could alienate people? I am sorry but social justice is a term that is not a unifying term.
            I suggest using my favorite hashtag as your motto: #LoveGodandHonorHimByServingOthers

        6. CS Lewis has variously been described as a Christian fascist, a drug addict, an admirer of Hitler’s 3rd Reich and a fantasist whose most famous books laud a lion god and a menagerie of petulant talking animals with bloodthirsty proclivities. Perhaps you could pick a better avatar for libertarian values which have the virtue of being summed up pithily in one sentence: Why should I have to pay for someone else?

          1. Paul

            I’ll answer your last question: (and pose a new one)
            __________________

            Why should I “have to” pay for someone else?

            You shouldn’t.
            __________________

            Why “should” I pay for someone else?

            Because God’s Agape Love is Charity and giving is the best possible way of showing people you love them as you love yourself. It is and should be the practice of all God’s people.

            “haveing to” robs everybody of everything. Including charity, relationship, free will, sacrifice, kindness, giving with a cheerful heart, giving in private and most importantly God’s Glory.

        7. Taylor,
          Thank you so much for your contribution to this conversation! Do you have a blog I can follow? I have copied everything you wrote for my own reference, but I would love to know who you are and how to read more of what you have to say!

          1. Thank you Shaunie, you are too kind.

            I do, but it’s fairly random. 🙂
            http://biggerthanme.net

        8. [lease explain to me how those are different!!!!!!!

        9. Taylor, do you happen to have a blog somewhere detailing your thoughts on this?

          1. I have a blog http://biggerthanme.net
            I still need to convert some of this SJW stuff over to it.

        10. Here’s the problem: when you read the Gospels, you are reading accounts where Jesus is offering grace, mercy, and forgiveness, but the context is incredibly important because Jesus tends to choose the marginalized to demonstrate grace, mercy, and forgiveness because they have been oppressed and treated as outcasts by the political and religious leaders. If we read the Gospels correctly, Jesus’ death on the cross is a form of passive resistance against the powers that be. Jesus’ death is very political–the charges were insurrection and claiming to be a king, after all. Jesus was telling Pilate, Caesar, and the Temple leaders that the power of God’s kingdom (love, service, and sacrifice) will defeat the powers of force, violence, and power.

          1. Jonathan

            I agree, in part. Jesus came for theEstablished Jews and was rejected because of their trust, allegiance and care was placed in the Government (Rome or Sanhedrin.)

            The marginalized folks you correctly point out, were in fact, the second choice (not the target) as we see in the Parable of the Wedding feast. They were willing to come to Jesus because they were ignored by either Rome or the Established Jews. They had nothing to lose. Jesus offered them what the Government wouldn’t. And for that reason, they followed him.

            My contention is not that the poor and marginalized shouldn’t be cared for, it is that I don’t understand why, as Christians we want a Government to do it. When it those very people the Governments cared for that ignored and rejected Jesus.

        11. God is just. Maybe you don’t see the obvious work of God in social justice, but if you read the Old Testament you can see God working towards social justice. Especially look to Isaiah where it seems freedom from oppression is a theme in justice

          1. I seriously doubt you actually want to go Old Testament when referencing God’s Justice. It was pretty harsh at times and full of Wrath.

            This Sunday my pastor spoke about the “contrast” of Justice and Mercy. Something to think about.

            The origin of the term can be traced to a few nineteenth-century Catholic theologians, who used the phrase to mean something closer to the traditional Roman definition of “justice,” which consists of doing no harm to others and having a respect for what a person owns. When the adjective “social” was first applied, it carried no further connotation than does placing “criminal” in front of justice. There had previously existed only the Christian expectation that those who were more fortunate would provide aid to those who had less. Charity was exclusively voluntary.

            Social Justice is NOW used as a political term tied to property rights and redistribution of wealth. It is in every way a creator of oppression.

        12. Taylor, you seem to be a perfect example of what it means to look at the pointing finger instead of where it’s pointing. Specifically, you’re ‘biblical expertise’ completely distracts you from the transcendent good it alludes to. Not unusual but sad nonetheless.

          1. Chris,

            “completely distracts you from the transcendent good it alludes to.”

            “Completely?” You know this, how?

            This is an extreme judgment to make, by someone who knows so little about me.

            That said:

            I’m not looking at the pointing finger, but the words being used to do define the pointing finger. Also, I am not willing to justify the means because of a (questionable) “goodish” end.

            For instance:
            Mexican Drug Lords build hospitals, schools and another infrastructure the Government neglects.

            Do the people benefit? Absolutely
            Does El Chapo benefit? Absolutely
            Does the drug cartel do evil things? Absolutely
            Are those employed by drug cartels often mistreated? Absolutely
            Are other parts of the world damaged by the drug trade? Absolutely

        13. Keep reading buddy. Jesus offers us the Kingdom of God. Jesus says, “kingdom come, the will be done. On EARTH as it is in heaven”. We are to help usher in Gods Kingdom and this includes the eradication of injustice… unless you believe injustice will be in the kingdom of God.

        14. Taylor:
          Grace, mercy, and forgiveness are Social Justice.

      2. ^ Exactly. The Religious nationalism we’ve got going here in America has really been rearing it’s ugly head lately.

        It’s no longer a matter of what disrespects America as much as what disrespects God…sometimes they are the same, often (and maybe especially lately?) they are different. In other words, it’s very possible that sometimes (not always), disrespecting the nation anthem, flag, etc, could be a way of respecting the things God cares for.

      3. Great point. This is a case of a Christian being persecuted for not placing the flag above his faith. This has nothing to do with race as ANY reason for him kneeling out the anthem would have gotten him the same response.

      4. Yes, yes, yes. I wonder why our allegiance to a country and a flag is considered so “Christian.” Our allegiance is first and foremost to Christ. Love for Christ and love for country are not one in the same.

    3. “Read the Constitution” You mean the one written by slave owners? Our nation has always been undecided about what its values are. We proclaim that “All men are created equal”, then continued to suppress women, own Africans, slaughter Native Americans, deny rights to those who weren’t landowners, etc.

      I think America is much like the Church – a lot of good intentions, but often a lack of actually follow-through. Sometimes there are good people accidentally doing bad, sometimes there are well-meaning people who are blind to their hypocrisy, sometimes there are evil people that push their own agenda. And sometimes there are truly good people who accomplish amazing things. America has fostered a LOT of oppression and racial division, and it still does, to a lesser extent.

      Also, I’m pretty sure Kaepernick never said anything about blaming all white people.

      1. Thank you for that. Slavery is entrenched within the constitution and “all men” meant all white men because blacks were on 3/5 of a man. So “all” did not include African Americans, Native Americans, or women. Black lives did not matter.

        1. Slavery isn’t “entrenched within the constitution” any longer. Read the 13th amendment.

          1. Yes, please read it again…especially the part that allows for the enslavement of those who are incarcerated.

    4. A in convenient truth that gets deliberately ignored is that historically it is the Democratic Party that designed instutiinal and systemic racists policies. The KKK was the militant arm of the party. Jim Crow laws were done by this party. Republicans fought against slavery as one part of the civil war and at that time
      no Republican owned a single slave. I agree such caricature don’t reveal the truth..

      1. Who cares if there was a historical role reversal between Democrats and Republicans? What I care about is what both parties are doing now.

        If Republicans today are turning a blind eye to racial injustice, why should they get credit for what Lincoln did 150 years ago? Similarly, if the Democrats of today are taking up the cause of racial justice, aren’t they the moral heirs of Lincoln more than present-day Republicans?

      2. You cite historical moments without the historical context. Lincolns actions are what created the racial divide in political parties. Because Lincoln was a republican, white supremacists fled to the Democratic Party. When LBJ, a democrat, fought for and signed the civil rights act of 1964, white supremacists fled to the Republican Party. The party itself didn’t really matter. White supremacists will support whichever party does the least for minorities and does the most to uphold social inequalities. I think this latest presidential election personifies Frosts argument here as well as this racial component of politics. Trump, a serial rapist who has, in his professional life, been found guilty of discriminating against blacks, and in his political life demonized non-whites and openly discussed his efforts as those for white christians, has found support from many christians. These are the “Tebows” of America and who are hyper focused on issues like abortion and are actively against or oblivious to issues of social justice like police brutality, equal pay for equal work, and just generally having empathy for marginalized groups. Trump is not a Christian. Trump hates women, has been divorced several times, has been repeatedly accused of violating women’s personal space, hates marginalized people, would promote the death penalty being used on black teens be falsely accused of murder, and so on. He does the opposite of what Jesus preached. But he would appoint someone to the Supreme Court who would be motivated to overturn roe v wade. Christians would have the elderly, women, and the poor lose their healthcare, have muslims enslaved or persecuted, and give police more latitude and resources to harm marginalized communities, all so they could maybe make abortion illegal again.

        1. “If you can convince the lowest white man he’s better than the best colored man, he won’t notice you’re picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he’ll empty his pockets for you.” – President Lyndon B. Johnson

          Yay for the Orwellian high taxed “great society”! <– sarcasm

          http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/lyndon-johnson-civil-rights-racism

          I am NO fan of Trump and refused to vote for him. But it is humorous to note a fair bit of Trump's bad behavior including the infamous 2005 "grab her by the p—y" quote in was when he was a registered Democrat and good friends with the (speaking of serial rapists) Clintons (who attended his fourth wedding.)

          This election (likely all elections) left no one with clean hands or a reasonable platform to champion. It is sad for sure.

          As a former Republican, I saw the damage mixing Jesus with politics has done to both Jesus and that political Party. I continue to do my best to keep them as separate as possible in my evaluating, thinking, Faith and allegiances.

          Had I simply switch political sides in some naive belief that the "other" Party is more like Jesus, I'd be no better off and likely blind to the obvious similarities of redefining Jesus to fit my political, social, and economic objectives.

    5. Arthur Hall, by your own admission, the first stone has long ago been cast. You can’t have “reverse racism” without first having “racism”. And what is “reverse racism” anyway? Shouldn’t it be loving everyone unconditionally? Perhaps a little introspection and self discovery would benefit us all.

    6. Amen to this first comment, let us be “United together in Love” All Christians are renewing their minds to Christ.Let us not weary in doing good.Let us all search our hearts and minds to do God ‘s perfect will ,not our own.Swallow our pride,honour our government leaders even if we disagree,deny ourselves,even if it is porn or gay tendancies or stealing ,lying,coveting what others have,and admit Our Need for a perfect Christ and not Bash one another.

    7. How can you relate the story of Jesus calming mob justice to Kaepernick’s protest? It makes no logical sense to equate the moral hypocrisy and violence of the mob to an individual’s protest against moral hypocrisy and violence. I am sure if you are being intellectually honest you can see the spurious nature of the argument. I am not sure about the Christianity of Kaepernick or Tebow. I have never met either nor discussed their faith with them. However, I am always a bit skeptical of those who pray in public as we are warned by Jesus against the practice of self-congratulatory prayer in Matthew 6:6. You seem to care about your Christianity so I speak in that spirit here. The real issue we are facing right now in the church is a historic battle between Classic Christianity or historic Christianity (think the Apostles Creed) and movement Christianity (think Pentecostalism and speaking in tongues.) This is a long discussion and beyond what this post could conclude. But I will say this a rule I think all Christians whether modernist, Evangelical, or social justice Christians should live by is to always ask themselves when confronted with theological quandaries, “What does that have to do with the Gospel or healing broken spirits?” Secondly, we need to be real with the history of political movements in the United States. The political correctness of Evangelicals to adhere to Republican candidates and political principles is both unnecessary and a dangerous “Movement Christianity” in and of itself. I will put it this way. Many of the Jews of ancient Palestine believed Jesus would be a political leader who came to overthrow the tyranny of the Romans and bring 1,000 years of peace. Obviously, that didn’t happen and Jesus was clear, “I come not to bring peace but a sword.” What did Jesus mean by “a sword?” Being God Jesus knew that history would bring many wars related to Christianity from the 30 Years War to the Inquisition. However, those were clearly sectarian wars. The social impact of Christianity is articulated in Paul’s Epistle to the Ephesians where he states that “There is neither Jew nor Gentile, slave nor free, man nor woman but all are one in Christ Jesus.” This was and perhaps still is a radical proclamation that lays claim to the values of human equality, human freedom, and gender equality. All of these issues have played out through battle primarily in the Civil War and the accompanying fight for Civil Right. Both sides, North and South, in the Civil War believed God was one their side. A “Great Revival” occurred among Robert E. Lee’s forces in the fall of 1863 and winter of 1864. Some 7,000 soldiers were converted. Revivals also swept the Union Army at that time. Sometimes preaching and praying continued 24 hours a day, and chapels couldn’t hold the soldiers who wanted to get inside. So whose side was God really on? To most Americans that answer seems intuitive that God was on the side of freedom. The outcome of one of the bloodiest wars in human history (600,000 casualties and an average of 30% casualties per battle.) However, there is still a battle going on in Christianity as to whether our society has resolved the issues that were at the core of the Civil War. That being that are all humans created equal and do they have a right to equal rights or protection under the constitution and the practice of the law? When one says, “Black Lives Matter” or kneel to protest that our nation’s inability to live up to those values one must weigh what is more important, “The outwardly display of patriotism (perhaps in the name of God, perhaps not?) Or the inward commitment to fight for principles of human freedom and equality no matter what cross one must bear? These are the questions we must be asking and answering.

    8. I think Mr. Frost is pointing out that one version is the Christianity Americans support, while they despise the other… meanwhile, it ought to be both/and. Private prayer and corporate action.

      As I’ve said a lot since the election… We always pray for our leaders, but we ACT on behalf of the least of these.

    9. Arthur, you are NUTS if you think the constitution prevents social injustices from being carried out against people of color. This article nails the hypocrisy of people claiming to be Christian and sitting idly while people are being oppressed for their skin color (among other things). You are, either intentionally or not, implying that black people are DESERVING of the unfair treatment they get by our criminal justice system. That is either rooted in racism or ignorance or both. It is not rooted in Christianity.

    10. Not sure if this is the right place to comment but I totally agree with the last line of the entire article. I think what might need to be added also two it is, yes we will remain on our knees even to the point of losing our heads for our faith.

    11. Frosty,

      I love the point you are making – that the gospel is both personal and social. And it clearly is!

      Not too fond of the hint of “Kaepernick good – Tebow bad” feel of this post. And definitely wondering if you did all your homework.

      Tebow has been involved in TONS of social justice issues. His gospel is both personal and social.

      Kaepernick wears t-shits supporting former Cuban dictator Fidel Castro. Kaepernick wears socks showing policemen as pigs. Not exactly pro social justice statements.

      I go back to where I started – I love the point you are making that the gospel is both personal and social. But you left out much of the good social justice work that Tebow has done and overlooked the misguided social justice statements that Kaepernick has made by his actions.

      And I join you in praying for the day that racial discrimination and social injustice come to an end.

      Blessings to you and yours.

    12. I reject the Pharisees.

    13. I disagree that Biblical Christianity should be, as Walter Brueggemann expressed it, “awed to heaven, rooted in earth.” and yes, join the angels in praise” but cannot keep our feet in time and place.”

      True Biblical Christianity is “AWED IN HEAVEN, ROOTED IN JESUS CHRIST”

      It was the apostle Paul which wrote in Colossians,

      6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:
      7 ROOTED AND BUILT UP IN HIM, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.
      8 BEWARE lest any man spoil you through PHILOSOPHY AND VAIN DECEIT, after the TRADITION OF MEN, after the RUDIMENTS OF THE WORLD , and not after Jesus Christ.
      9 For in Jesus dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
      Colossians 2:6-9

      True Biblical Christianity does not say in the Bible “keep your feet in time and place” but does state that,

      1 I waited patiently for the Lord;
      and he inclined unto me, and heard my cry.
      2 He brought me up also out of an horrible pit, out of the miry clay,
      and SET MY FEET UPON A ROCK, and established my goings.
      3 And he hath put a new song in my mouth, even praise unto our God.
      Psalm 40:1-3

      THE LORD IS MY ROCK, and my fortress, and my deliverer; MY GOD, my strength, IN WHOM I WILL TRUST; my buckler, and the horn of my salvation, and my high tower.
      Psalms 18:2

      20 Are built upon the FOUNDATION of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the CHIEF CORNERSTONE;
      21 in whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
      22 in whom ye also are BUILDED TOGETHER for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
      Ephesians 2:20-22

      6 Wherefore also CONTAINED IN THE SCRIPTURES, “Behold, I lay in Sion a CHIEF CORNERSTONE, elect, precious: and he that believeth on Him shall not be confounded.
      7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, THE STONE which the builders disallowed, the same is made the HEAD OF THE CORNER,
      8 and a STONE OF STUMBLING, and a ROCK OF OFFENSE, even to them which STUMBLE AT THE WORD, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
      1 Peter 2:6-8

      True worship to God must worship God as He exist, not as we wish Him to be.

    14. Regarding TEBOW; Why was he kneeling? Matthew 6:5-6 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites [are]: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

    15. Well said! This article is written with broad generalizations about Christianity and our nation which are not well researched.

    16. Kaepernick: “When I step on the field, I always say a prayer, say I am thankful to be able to wake up that morning and go out there and try to glorify the Lord with what I do on the field.”
      Tebow: “…spent his summers in the Philippines, helping with his father’s orphanage…”

      Yet Tebow is the man of personal faith and Kaepernick is the man of social justice, and never the two sides meet?

    17. Mr. Frost,
      This article is Horrible. It’s so Obvious to see how one sided your view is! Unfortunately you are part of the problem. Not the Solution! If your views are so jaded. As obvious in this article. Maybe you should change professions? Because you can’t even be an honest writer. Sad. My heart goes out to you & my thoughts & prayers will be with you.

      1. I am amazed at the negative response and criticism of the original article by Mr Frost. Why can’t we read an interesting point of view without picking every detail apart? Why must there be a knee-jerk reaction, mostly from those who passionately call themselves Christians yet totally miss the point of the writing? To me, and I come from a Christian background, these strident objections serve to make a lot of people (me included) turn away from radical Christians in disgust. Let’s open our hearts and minds and follow the examples in the life of Jesus Christ!

    18. What a misleading article. Tim Tebow is actually a Christian. Not in the sense of naming the name of Christ only, but in striving to live a life as Christ calls us to live. Kaepernick displays tatoos with symbols and words, but is more interested in Communist leaders and Islam as well as focusing on some misguided hypocritical kneeling campaign. Stand for the Flag, as the God of Heaven commands and kneel for the Cross to pray. I pray for this country and for the misguided who blindly follow Keapernick’s folly

    19. Arthur, your cognitive dissonance is astounding.

  2. Amazing. I have watched myself transform from being a Tim Tebow to a Colin Kaepernick. And I felt something was amiss. This post clearly shows what is amiss in my metarmophosis.

    1. Thank you.

    2. I think the goal is to be both, not transform from one to the other.

  3. Pick two, any two. These two young men are not ground zero of the church sent to its knees any more than Alan Hirsch and Russell Moore. Both of these men stand for what they think is right. Whether I agree with one or both does not put me in a battlefield of warring Christians. I am concerned that for some of you Christian philosophers, you have made that often times inevitable transition that every one who isnt us is them. And we all know who they are.

    1. (a) I’m not a Christian philosopher. (b) I’m not encouraging a war between Christians. In fact, the whole point of the blog is that we have much to learn from each other and need to find a integral third way that includes personal piety and public activism.

      1. I wish that was how I read it. From a few other comments, I wasnt the only one who thought you were promoting the rift. I see very little difference in the two young men. If you look into Mr. Tebow, you will find that he too is villified by many, including those Christians you speak of.
        You have a wonderful philosophy on how one should live a Christian life, thus the philosopher reference. I think the battle lines are now with the definition of what a Christian is.

        1. What did you think I meant by this line, “The bifurcation of contemporary Christianity into two distinct branches is leaving the church all the poorer, with each side needing to be enriched by the biblical vision of the other.”

          1. I think you have seen other comments that maybe read that they maybe saw that you maybe presented one of the young men in a maybe more positive light. Maybe.
            I agree there are differences within the church. Dunk, sprinkle; wine, juice; organ, guitars; missionsry, missional, etc. A dialog needs to be the norm. But, again, I maybe read your piece in a vein that even though it called for unity, I saw come over to our side. Perhaps, maybe some others read it that way too.

          2. I think the article does leave the impression that the author has a more positive outlook on Kaepernick than Tebow.

      2. Absolutely. Thank for continuing to repeat our command to “Seek justice, love mercy, and walk humbly with our God.” Your article reminds us that we are always in danger of seeing “them” as “not us,” and we are ALL “us.”

        1. Hi Pastor D, quick question. “Seek” justice – which version of the Bible are you quoting? I just did a search on Bible Gateway and none of the versions used the word “seek” before justice. This verse seems to require us as individuals to act justly, do what is right, practice justice, be just, etc. etc. (along with being kind, showing love, being merciful, full of grace, and walking humbly with our God). This seems to be a very personal, inward command…not seeking it from others or from the government. In fact, only the NET version (which uses the word “promote” justice) could be construed as you getting others to act justly, practice justice, do what is right, etc. etc. Is that what you were intending to convey with quoting this verse? That we personally should act justly or do what is right versus trying to advocate for policy/law changes?

      3. Mike Frost, I do understand what you tried to point out in your article. And I see from most of the comments that my point is made. The dialog we both seek is lost in the need to lovingly bring others to my way of thinking. I believe the church is not what it was meant to be. And none of the philosophers of today can bring it back. It is truly a matter of the heart.

  4. I think Christians need a long track record of service before they start attacking Christians who bring the Kingdom to others in multiple ways. (Not referring to you Mike).

    We need good definitions of what following Jesus looks like. (Not the Christmas Day photo at the mission serving food Christians) — but big commitment in time, treasure into nieghbors, city. Spontaneous acts to people because they love others and care.

  5. It seems to me that a lot of what you’re claiming are the issues are presented in a very one sided way. I don’t see how Tebowing is any less a public statement than not rising. You’ve assigned gentleness, could you give any justification for that? Abortion and homosexuality are no less emphasised on either side, it is just a disagreement as to what the correct moral solution is.
    The key difference seems to really be between those who believe that our current social arrangements are basically in line with God’s will and should be tweaked, and those who believe that the structure is fundamentally flawed and needs a major upheaval – the difference between teaching on the temple steps and casting out the money lenders

    1. Mike is describing the current reality and calling for each side to learn from the other, not promoting one way of believing/being over the other. A bunch of readers missed the point, apparently.

      1. That’s the stated point, but I don’t think that’s the actual impression the writing makes. I say that as somebody who has roots in the Tebowist camp but who strongly supports Kaepernick’s generosity and advocacy for social justice, although not necessarily the decision regarding the anthem. I think the article creates the impression that Tebowist Christians are Pharisaic hypocrites who need to learn more respect for the Kaepernick viewpoint. It does so through the way Tebow’s piety is portrayed, how Kaepernick’s good deeds and prayer are portrayed, and how the reaction by obviously Tebowist Christians to Kaepernick’s protest is portrayed. It feels disingenuous and slimy, although I rather doubt the author intended it that way.

    2. John, it is not the difference but the fact that Jesus, our example, did both of these actions. Followers of Christ must be both salt and light in our fallen world.
      We are to have “this mind” in us and that will truly change our country in a God honoring way.

      1. No way Jesus did what these guys did. Tebow drew attention to himself when he knelt and prayed. Jesus prayed alone in the garden so hard he sweat blood. He did not stand in protest of the government for killing his brethren. He did not wear socks that said Roman guards are pigs. He told his followers Not to do that but to serve them twice as far as they had to. He did not pose for foto ops in front of parole offices because he wanted to impress someone to give him a big contract. He didn’t protest for the disenfranchised on MSNBC or CBN but served them humbly.

  6. As a pastor and a theologian I think you hit on some of the deep seated divisions that effect America at this time. You just show them from the theological realm.. I felt you showed much of the issues dividing Mainline Protestants vs. evangelicals etc. I’m not trying to paint with too broad a brush, but I know you weren’t trying to either. My father was a big civil rights leader in the 60s and says the country is much more divided today than then (he told me this 10 years ago). I am often deeply troubled how everything is “either or” and not “both and”. I respect both guys and find faithfulness at times in both. Why do we feel one has to be right and the other wrong? Isn’t their a powerful witness to God’s kingdom in both? At least something to deeply reflect on as the body? Thank you for your words. I will dwell on them more! Peace.

  7. Wondering why you list Tebow as a speaker and moraliser/preacher and don’t mention his philanthropic and aid work in Haiti etc?
    Not saying this as a fan of one over the other, genuine question.

    1. That’s the problem with the article. It purports to say both sides need each other, but I think anybody with a Tebow leaning would think the article describes Tebowas if he’s a Pharisee and Kaepernick as the true Sermon on the Mount Christian. I don’t think the author intended it that way, but that’s how it came across.

    2. No matter which “side” a reader of an article like this comes from, there’s a pretty good chance he/she is going to read it as if it is attacking his/her side. Mike’s point wasn’t to describe every single aspect of each of these men’s Christianity. Only to describe the parts they are each most known and loved/hated for.
      To attack him as “favoring one over the other” only proves his point that the division between two groups of Christians is very, very deep.

  8. An interesting post. As a Christian, and a fan of American Football, but not an American, I’ve watched the careers of both Tebow and Kaepernick with interest (Kaep more so, as a 49ers fan…).

    I’m not entirely convinced that this isn’t a little bit of a false dichotomy. The vilification of Kaepnerick is, from this side of the pond, primarily because he has challenged the great American idol – America itself. I don’t think things would’ve been nearly as bad for him had he chosen to kneel at some occasion other than the national anthem.

    (Having said that – I understand that you’re perhaps talking less about the actual Tebow/Kaepernick stories, and more about what they could be seen to represent within the church)

    1. You are 100% correct! Is the US perfect? No, it’s not. But, it has come a long way, and just like every other country has a long way to go to be perfect.

      People died to give that idiot the freedoms he has.

      Where was his activism prior? Non-existent. He is a hypocrite. I haven’t seen him in the news for his continued activism either. Nope, what I’ve seen is that he has now decided to stand for the nation anthem…hmmmm, likes his multi-million dollar paycheck.

      1. One person died to give that idiot – and all of us idiots – freedom. Many died for a human institution represented by the flag. Freedom is no more granted by the flag or Constitution than it is by Burger King or Rotary Club. Freedom is no more protected by violence than it is promoted by people who hate those who actually practice freedom.

      2. Right – people died to give him that freedom. So why are you upset when he uses it in a non-violent, and constructive manner? I’m obviously not dead, but I’m a veteran and I support his protest. And a lot of other veterans do too. Jackie Robinson refused to stand for the national anthem too, and he’s rightly praised as a hero of the civil rights movement.

        When you say activism, do you mean charity work? He’s been involved with a lot of charities long before this protest

  9. I truly thought you were going to pit one ‘Christianity’ against the other, taking the ‘Kaepernick’ side. Very glad you didn’t as we do so need both branches together. Nice one.

  10. Nice piece, thank you. The underlying theme is important for people to read right now. Collin’s own drug use and run-in with the law will be an unfortunate distraction to the real message.

  11. I see this dichotomy not in individual piety vs corporate evil but rather in an obsession with sexual “purity” (as defined in very narrow terms) vs a wholistic view of both individual and corporate holiness. (Unless of course you are a person of power like the president or a Fox News pundit).

    Yes, following Jesus is both individual and corporate but this article creates a false equivalence between civil religion and the things that Jesus talked about

  12. I agree with nearly everything you say. Well done.

    I do take significant issue with the patriarchal idea that abortion is a sin.

    Medical procedures are. They aren’t sinless or sinful, they simply are.

    1. So you are arguing that the taking of a life is not sin? Where might the commandment “thou shalt not murder” play into this, or are you saying it does not?

  13. How does diversity make the church poorer? There is one body, but it has many parts. But all its many parts make up one body. It is the same with Christ. 13 We were all baptized by one Holy Spirit. And so we are formed into one body. It didn’t matter whether we were Jews or Gentiles, slaves or free people. We were all given the same Spirit to drink. 14 So the body is not made up of just one part. It has many parts.

  14. This article picks two versions of Christianity and puts them up as THE two choices (it also pretty obviously endorses one and ridicules the other). It’s not true. Don’t follow these two versions – they aren’t even completely accurately characterized. Follow Jesus. If you want to judge Christianity on its improvement of the current social climate or on how well it aligns with your particular opinions on moral issues, I think you’re barking up the wrong tree – you’ll end up frustrated. Try to use the same meter sticks to measure what Jesus himself actually did and said, and you will conclude that He also needs some improvement, which is preposterous. Neither of these measuring tools have anything to do with why the real Jesus came: to redeem YOU from YOUR sin.

    Jesus was not primarily concerned with politics and social justice. If he was, he would have said and done a lot of things different, staged some protests and stand-ins. Jesus actually chose NOT to protest against a government that was overtly oppressing a certain group of people. He healed people not primarily to show us the value of philanthropy, but to show us that He was God in the flesh. When Jesus addresses physical poverty it is always a metaphor for spiritual poverty, and his point is always that He is the only antidote for that. You can give people food all your life, but if you have not given them Jesus (the REAL food), you have given them nothing of lasting value. You have only satisfied your insatiable thirst for self-justification.

    He also was not primarily issue oriented, and neither was His first allegiance to anything physical. His teachings are not primarily focused on actions, but attitudes. He is always teaching us to move our faith from our hands to our hearts. A right heart leads to right actions, not the other way around. Works follow faith. To be clear, God is righteous and does have righteous rules for us to live by, but living by his rules does not produce faith, and by itself rule following does not make God happy. He wants us to stop being concerned with looking like we follow God on the outside and just ACTUALLY follow God.

    1. I disagree. He is not positioning one form of Christianity against the other. He is pointing out the hypocrisy of Christians to condemn the Christian behavior of one while celebrating the other. I love both football players because of their Christian stance. One is being more proactive about social injustice (Christian) while the other is more concerned with personal purity. Neither is wrong. However, how would Christ treat those who condemn Kaep? Would he say “good job”? Or would he consider you like the Pharisees?

    2. Jv,
      I read through your response again And now I realize that you’re suggesting that Jesus WAS NOT concerned with social injustice. You therefore are suggesting that God is OK with it. Consider reading the Beatitudes.
      https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+5&version=NIV&interface=amp

  15. I wish I could say you were being too generic. Unfortunately, I don’t think these two caricatures are too far from the truth. Yes, there are always nuances, but it seems we have allowed ourselves to homogenize in America into predictable social and faith-based communities. Its our fault really.

    Thanks for writing this, and most importantly, thanks for trying to restrain yourself enough to be somewhat objective and leave us with more questions than answers…it’s the kind of thought and writing that’s needed these days. After all, if the Christian community can’t come to terms with and understand what it means to differentiate and sit in-between two opposing viewpoints, we have completely lost all understanding of the God we serve (who is both 3 and 1, and revealed himself in Christ as both FLESH and SPIRIT).

  16. Mike,
    Thank you for a thoughtful article that pushes an important conversation forward. It is telling that my first reaction upon seeing the thumbnail was “whoever wrote this will either be bashing Tim Tebow’s christianity or Colin Kaepernick’s.” I appreciate your sensitivity to preserving the importance of both ends of the spectrum while clearly articulating a need for a unified vision that takes into account the views of others. As a pastor, I see a wave of young Colin Kaepernick’s and applaud their willingness to put their bodies, their words, their money, etc. into social justice issues, truly embodying the Jesus of the NT, but I also see an older generation of faithful men and women that have preserved Christianity faithfully the best they know how – have put their time, treasure, and talent into the next generation and now the two groups are divided. I pray for an imaginative unity that does not end in some “weak blend” of the two poles, but a “new thing.”

    Thanks again, I encourage you to continue writing and thinking in this direction – it makes a real different to real people doing real ministry. The issues run deep, but we must not turn back – listening and learning are not options for us.

    1. p.s. of course this is an over generalized article everyone… I invite everyone to do a complete analysis and inventory of their own theological presuppositions and note all the nuances present in your own faith formation. The point of this is to push an issue forward. Quit commenting garbage and write your own engaging article that people print out and grapple with in with their own faith communities.

      Bottom line: we are one body meant for diversity of function, thought, perspective, etc. None of you armchair critics are currently embodying 1st century Christianity that those who knew Jesus practiced, so let’s quit pretending that somehow we hold the keys to the “real Christianity” and listen to one another.

  17. I probably won’t get into a comment discussion, but only wanted to say thank you for this post. It gives me hope for the church.

    I could say more, but I’m tired of my words being misconstrued in these sorts of public places. So a simple “Thank you” will have to do.

  18. This is brief yet beautiful. Thank you for sharing. This is something the Church definitely needs to wrestle with in love.

  19. There’s a lot to process from this article. I agree that Christ is the unity we need, but there will always be disagreements even when it comes to interpretation of scripture that produces the separation between both camps. One is raised Baptist while the other is raised Methodist/Lutheran, which shouldn’t make a difference if we’re in Christ but in reality, that’s the basis for this whole observation. I guess you can also add that the particular view from one side is more culturally white American than the other side, which entails and attaches the mistakes and prejudices among the Christian pioneers who established this country. The dichotomy regarding this issue is a direct result of our pride, our depravity, and upbringing to enforce a stance according to our personal convictions to commit to one side. I don’t believe that has to be the case especially if we’re in Christ. It’s interesting to analyze nonetheless.

  20. Seems like the writer seems to be continuing to push the divide. Tebow is awesome. And… while I very much disagree with much of Kaepernick’s issues that he supports, I see him as a man who cares deeply about some very important issues… And for this, I deeply respect him… Here, though, is the “tell” from the article: “One is concerned with private sins like abortion. The other is concerned with public sins like racial discrimination.” … Killing nearly a million humans a year in the US is not a private issue. And the putting of many of these items on some sort of morally equivalent playing field (like the real remnants of racial discrimination in the US) is one of the main reasons for the divide…. “Tolerance” will not work. Many of the positions are mutually exclusive in and ethical, spiritual, and moral sense… The “Left’s” answer is for the “Right” to simply embrace things that most believers cannot. And the “Right” holds a similar stance. The reality is that the sin in our camp of The West is what is taking us down. … And simply playing nice and ‘tolerating’ everything will make us even less powerful than ever. We will quench the Spirit to an incredible degree. The evidence of this can be seen in many of the denominations that have given themselves over to total “inclusiveness.” They have become anemic and snitty. They have even begun to devour each other. …. YES, we gotta love each other. Totally. And, I will, to my dying breath, respect every person’s right to believe as they see fit. But, for us to miss the insidious influx of moral equivalence and tolerance of blatant sin will not strengthen the church in the west, it may very well put it into greater chaos than it already is.

    1. To say that abortion is a private sin (because it is a personal choice made an individual) doesn’t in any way minimize its gravity or its social consequences. It feels like you’re the one trying to drive people apart here.

  21. How odd that some comments here seem to think I’m being critical of Tim Tebow. I wasn’t. As to the more challenging criticism that I was caricaturing the two individuals to make my point, I can see how people could see that. However, I think it’s fair to say that Tebow’s reputation is based on his personal piety (tebowing and sexual purity) as Kaepernick’s is on his political stance. This isn’t to say Kaepernick isn’t personally pious, nor that Tebow isn’t concerned with community development or philanthropy. My point is that Christian people feel aligned to one OR the other, based on their public reputations, and that we should resist such a bifurcation and embrace both.

    1. I know you didn’t intend to create the impression that you were critical of Tebow, but I would ask you to consider whether the article could reasonably create that impression. Imagine that you’re a Christian in the Tebow camp of conservatives and that you’re familiar with the Sermon on the Mount. Jesus teaches that being truly generous and praying personally are more valuable than posturing and public prayer. The actual things the article emphasizes are Kaepernick’s true generosity and his quote about private prayer. It emphasizes Tebow’s posturing and public prayer, omitting an equivalent description of his generosity. For many Tebowist types, it creates the impression that Tebow is the Pharisee and Kaepernick is the true Christian, and Tebowist types could learn a thing or two. I don’t think you meant it that way, but that’s how the article could come across to a stereotypical conservative evangelical.

      1. I don’t agree with you. At all. You’d have to be overly sensitive to read it that way. I refer to his missionary work, his stance on sexual purity, his preaching, his public prayer. How is that in any way critical? How does that make him look like a pharisee? If i describe Kaepernick’s charitable work in more detail it’s because that’s an area of his life some readers might be less aware of, and because it was currently in the news during the off season.

        1. Mike, that’s okay. I’m just trying to explain to you why some people respond to it like it’s criticizing Tebow and holding up Kaepernick. Here’s another point. I ran the description of Tebow and the description of Kaepernick up to the transition to his protest into a word count. The article has right around twice as many words about Kaepernick’s non-protest good stuff as about Tebow’s good stuff. 314 vs. 159.

          Do you agree that it’s entirely possible for you to write an article about two camps that you believe is fair but that comes across as belittling to one of those camps?

    2. Is it really bad to disagree with Kapernick’s stances vilifying cops. I know many Christian cops that Kapernick referred to as pigs and murderers. There are much more issues at stake here than the church and Christianity.

  22. This article is a divide. I read the whole thing twice. Why create such a divide. It makes the readers decide which side they are on. Is this a christian way? You try hard to not show a clear bias towards Tim.., by noting colins charaties and donations….. but most of this is subtly and implicitly slamming a man who speaks out for a people group know as the blacks. Why spend so much writing noting coilins family race. You tell of the skin color of his mom and dad. Her age when she gave birth ect. What’s the point of that…what’s your purpose here…..what’s your purpose …..nothing but hate for Colin…good try at trying to take the high road in this article. Try writing an article to show Christian unity…that will better impact the world. This article is garbage.

  23. So tired of the liberal Christians who glorify Kapernick and vilify Tebow. This article conveniently left out Tebow’s charitable work with the poor in the the Philippines and that he also raised millions to build a hospital over there for the poor. Apparently Asians are less important than Africans for the social justice warriors. Kapernick is unpopular with NON-Christians by the millions for his attacks on cops and wearing clothing depicting them as pigs. Not to mention protesting the national anthem. I am sorry but if I have to pick a roll model for my kid and it is between Tebow and Kapernick it isn’t much of a contest and that has nothing to do with who is the better Christian.

  24. I think part of the problem with how this article is perceived stems from two issues. One, is that Kaep is so controversial, Mike probably wanted to go out of his way to paint him in a favorable light. Also, just the format used probably played on peoples’ expectations.

    Often, an article will be formatted “This sounds good, but here’s the rebuttal and why you were wrong to agree with what I was suggesting before”. That was never intended here, but we’ve seen so many articles like that, that it’s easy for our brain to assume that’s the case here. I don’t think Mike did anything wrong with writing the article as he did, it just might have benefited from being more overt that this wasn’t an attempt to paint one side as being bad

  25. Given the fact that I am being criticized by Tebow fans for being too negative toward him and not negative enough toward Kaepernick, and Kaepernick fans for being too negative toward him and not negative enough toward Tebow, it looks like I might have struck a reasonable balance.

    1. Mike, thank you for writing an article that tries to bring the church together around her mission. I only saw one comment that complained you unnecessarily racialized Kaepernick a bit, but I saw a few comments other than mine about the discussion of Tebow. I know it’s easy to put something on the Internet and get a lot of criticism, but I hope you will consider what could have been done better with this piece and not walk away happy that it’s a “reasonable balance.” Fostering unity between conservative-leaning suburban white Christians and the often younger social justice-oriented urban Christians is too important.

      1. 350 Facebook likes, 200 shares on Facebook, 5,000 shares from the site, 35,000 views, a request from the Washington Post to publish it – I think my message was clear to plenty of people.

        1. As Meatloaf would say, “Stop right there!” It is true that your article has brought on many comments and as in most Twitter and Facebook strings, it has taken on many lives of their own. But many of the comments are telling you you didn’t make the point that Christians have a problem and need to address it. In fact, many agree that you were one sided. And to have a publication like the Washington Post want to publish another example of them church people not getting along is not a good validation for someone with your following. No, the stats do not help the cause at all. You had a well meaning concern that came out on paper(screen) differently.

          1. And the many who say Mike was one sided in this article are simply dead wrong.

  26. This article was commented by a pastoral colleague of mine. Thank you Mike for trying to open up two ‘hands’ of Christianity to the other through the actions of two different men trying to live out faith as they know it. The fact of the matter is that there is an enormous divide in American Christianity. Neither of us rarely inhabit the other’s world. We go to different schools, admire different leaders, and the one book we do read together, the bible, is heard in vastly different ways. For many decades now, the divide in Christianity has not been along traditional, denominational lines. As a matter of fact, I was just at a Roman Catholic-Lutheran prayer service where both Lutheran and Catholic bishops presided in a show of Christian unity. Rather American Christianity (in particular) is divided by ecclesial lines much harder to quantify but seem, in general, to revolve around politics, nationalism, and interestingly enough, the theology of Revelation. Is salvation escape out of this world or does salvation come to this world? Is the goal to “get to heaven” or does the heavenly city come down to earth? (In short do you read more Hal Lindsey or N.T. Wright?) And what does it mean to pray, “thy will be done on earth AS IT IS in heaven” anyway? Perhaps we need to wrestle with all these questions with more grace and humility than we currently do.

  27. With respect for the point I think you would like to make, your view of Christianity buys into very old stereotypes and actually promotes the kind of divisions we would like to disappear.
    False dichotomies:
    personal piety/social justice
    private prayer/public protest
    personal salvation/political transformation

    Abortion and homosexuality are evaluated morally but social concerns and racism are not?
    (Moral evaluation should steer us to the good and is applicable to every issue, every day.)
    Abortion is a “personal” sin?

    The false assumptions and dichotomies have been used since the beginning of Christianity to divide.
    I’m with you. Let’s be united. Let’s assume the good in everyone, let’s assume that Christians are whole people, not caricatures.

    1. Well said, and I agree about the false dichotomies and their tendency to divide.

      Abortion and homosexuality are evaluated because they are aggressive Political Movements not because they hold some special immoral high ground. Christians would agree that pride, coveting, unforgiveness, worrying, fornication, adultery, fear, gossip and the like are shortcomings and sinful as well. No argument.

      However, I’d guess if a group of men suggested that their “adultery” was a born-that-way condition and then march for the Right to be accepted as adulters and Christians we’d elevate this topic as well, not because it’s “more” immoral, but because it had become aggressive and was being argued as no longer sinful.

      Admittedly, this is tricky.

      My creed is this:
      What does the Bible say to the unbeliever?
      Meet and know Jesus

      What does the Bible say to the believer?
      Everything else.

      I try my best NOT to mix the two.

      ________________________
      The application of Biblical Truth to politics, unbelievers, economics, science, and such requires force and thus is self defeating.

      Also; it is something Jesus simply didn’t do.

  28. I was a huge 49ers and Kaepernick fan, and I respected Kap’s belief that he had a moral obligation to engage in public protest. But the author of the article chooses to omit two incidents involving Kaepernick that speak to his views and might explain people’s dislike for him. (1) At the height of the attention on his protest, he purposefully wore socks at practice (where he knew there would plenty of photography) with “pig cops” on them — an ugly and juvenile representation of the view that cops = pigs. (2) While his team was in Miami, he wore a shirt celebrating Fidel Castro, a brutal Communist dictator who persecuted Christians and dissent of any kind. He also made public comments defending Castro. These were actions Kaepernick took deliberately and offered for public observation. They were actions that ended my fandom of him. For valid reasons I think.

  29. Sorry, Mike… I’m on my 4th reading of your article after having my opinions belittled on FB by a sister Christian, one planted firmly in the “Kaepernick camp”.
    I don’t know how many more times I’ll read your piece, but each time I do, it presents as lopsided, divisive and lacking in important facts, regardless of my desire to try to find something positive, unifying or peace promoting.

    Although I’ve never seen Kap’s body “festooned’ with religious tattoos” (as some rappers are also known to sport), I was aware of his charitable endeavors – similar to those of people like George Clooney or Matt Damon. Truth be told, Mike, your article is how I discovered Keapernick IS a Christian – something you could have quite interestingly written about without including an incomplete (or ANY) comparison to Tim Tebow.

    Jesus said, “You will know them by their fruits”, and all I (and many, MANY others) knew about Colin Kaepernick until now was that he disrespected our flag, our anthem and, thereby, our country [while also giving some money to charity].

    How does that fruit advance the gospel? How do the vast multitude of people he’s alienated feel anything more than further convinced that The Church is merely a group of hypocrites using lip service, knee service, and tiny portions of millions of dollars as a means of earning those all-important “brownie points” …the ones that nauseate those outside the church? And keep them there.

    #AllLivesMatter

    1. I’m a veteran, and I think Kaepernick’s protest was very respectful. And there are lots of veterans who agree. Jackie Robinson was a veteran, and is widely viewed as one of the most important figures in the struggle for civil rights, and he said he couldn’t stand and sing the national anthem as well.

      1. It was an exercise of his first amendment rights
      2. It was a peaceful protest
      3. It was effective at drawing attention, as opposed to most protests, which get ignored or forgotten
      4. He even got advice from a special forces soldier about how to do the protest in a way that was respectful, but still got his point across. That’s why he started kneeling.

      1. Thank you for your service to this great nation, Joel

  30. Thanks for your words Mike. I grew up in one Christian camp and have swung to the other (in Australia). I do feel a strong pull to keep the communication channels open, to keep trying to learn from and listen to Christians who think differently to me, but it’s hard… I feel greatly saddened at times by my brothers and sisters in Christ who seem to miss some of Jesus’ core teachings… and yet, that was me once too. And no doubt I still have blind spots! Your words remind me that we all need to remain humble, gracious and teachable. Thanks for urging us to keep working at reconciliation.

  31. […] friends on the political left are all over this tale of two public versions of Christianity on its knees, one represented by Colin Kaepernick and the […]

  32. This article really resonates with my experience. I grew up in the evangelical church, in a wonderful and close-knit community of believers. I credit that community with the strong sense of self and firm faith that eventually, when I got to college, led me to getting involved with community organizing and other social justice causes. When I excitedly, albeit naively, shared with my hometown community how my faith had been set ablaze by a new understanding of how to live out my values in public life, I was devastated by the response. A belief in American Exceptionalism and unthinking devotion to the Republican party were fuel for interactions where I was ridiculed and even yelled at during holiday parties for such benign statements as, “I think people who work 40 hours a week should be able to feed their kids and give them a safe place to live” and “I don’t think people should die because they don’t have access to healthcare.” While no one was able to tell me why these statements weren’t Christian enough, they were clear on why the solutions I was advocating for weren’t “American” enough.

    I have my feet firmly planted in both worlds described in this article, and it’s a painful place to be. I’ve gotten yelled at a bunch! Within my person, I don’t feel much conflict – I don’t have any issue stating that I am pro-life but also believe that it’s essential for women to have access to safe and legal abortions, for instance. I can’t for the life of me understand how someone who has read Jesus’s parable about the shepherd who walked away from his flock in order to save the one sheep that was most vulnerable can continue to hashtag alllivesmatter (with their fingers plugging up their ears, I can only assume). I believe in loving God with my whole heart, soul, mind, and strength, AND I believe that if loving my neighbor as I love myself means that some people are offended or their beloved patriotism, institutions, systems and beliefs get disrupted as internalized racism, sexism, imperialism, etc are challenged, then by God’s grace we’ll all live through it but there is no growth, spiritual, cultural, physical or otherwise without some pain.

    I also haven’t felt completely at home in any church community in over fifteen years, so there you go.

  33. First of all-I think this article is well intentioned!
    Second-many are reacting strongly but respectfully. I like that.
    This is a fact-we have a history of racism in this country. And the affects of racism are real and MANY are with us today.
    How should people protest injustice, not be ignored, and actually create change?
    I think protest is supposed to make us uncomfortable but then hopefully awaken our compassion for others-even those that look different, speak different, etc.
    Can someone define in specific terms what freedom is to them?
    If you’re more likely to be shot at a traffic stop or wrongly convicted of a crime or not hired for a job because of your race-are you free?
    Another fact-publicly glorifying God above any one or thing is rare.
    Does this make you more holy than others or less?
    Not necessarily.
    It does take courage!
    To hold up Jesus, not your own holiness, which is what I think he is doing is great!
    I’m grateful that we can usually safely express our faith in this country often receiving recognition and support from most others in our communities. In so many other countries in Asia, Africa, the Middle East-expressing love of Jesus can bring real oppression on a daily basis, even death.
    Jesus expressed profound empathy and compassion for others during His entire earthly ministry-that’s where we need to begin and end this conversation.
    And let us remember how we express our faith in Jesus-
    that we do this self righteously or with humble conviction-is something only Jesus knows for sure.
    I like to think both these men are to be admired for how they each challenge us to use our hard won freedoms to stand for
    Jesus
    AND
    the “least of these” (the most oppressed.)

  34. I agree with those who have said there should be no either/or. A commitment to social justice and the practice of personal piety are both important and the one is weakened without the other. Rev. Dr. William Barber combines the two. That said, Colin Kaepernick has offended so many precisely because he failed to conform to their nationalistic idolatry. The flag, the Pledge, the militaristic national anthem are given far more adoration than they should have, far more than is found in other western nations. I addressed how this developed -and why it is misguided- in my book Bowing Toward Babylon: The Nationalist Subversion of Christian Worship in America. The symbols, songs and rituals of nationalism place a lens in front of us that hinders Christians from more clearly seeing the meaning of the life and teaching of Jesus.

  35. To the prior discussions, I submit we keep in mind 1 Corinthians 10:31-33.
    God examines the heart, not accomplishments. So while one can focus in on earthly physical changes, helping people with physical needs, it was NOT the focus of Christ’s ministry. Christ came for spiritual redemption. In all that we do, we need to ask is it helping people to know the God of the Bible. Are we helping people to recognize and repent from sin. Its easy to get caught up in earthly goals and lose sight of the spiritual perspective. So the questions to ask are: Is a testimony of disrespecting a nation’s custom bring people closer or further away God? Does wearing Castro t-shirt, socks with police as pigs, etc. help others to know Christ? Jesus said we will always have the poor (Mt 26:11) One can extrapolate and say there will always be injustice (social or otherwise). It’s a fallen world and sinfulness abounds, sadly even in the church.
    Taylor has very solid points based on Scripture. No one is against helping the down trodden, the poor, the widows … I believe his point is that as believers we should not be looking to any political institution to do this. The church (us) should take this on because it will give glory to God and not glory to the institution. 1 Corinthians 10:31-33.
    Thanks for reading.

    1. Well said.

  36. Thank you for this article, Mr. Frost. Much to think on (and debate) here. One thing I’ll mention: I don’t understand why financial donations are included in this article. We don’t know what either man has contributed privately to charities or church or others in need. We know what the media reports. How do we know what Tebow has or hasn’t given? Or Kaepernick given more than is mentioned here? Amount doesn’t matter. Some Christians (and non-Christians) give as privately as possible. The New Testament spirit of giving is to do so generously and cheerfully and without fanfare.

  37. I don’t see Tebow as being “only” that and think that was a way of trying to separate the 2. I see him as being a social justice server of others as well while Kaepernick isn’t about transformation of the person at all. So really one person is “both” Christianities and one is only half, really. Apples and oranges…

  38. I am not sure this is accurate. I do not know that Kapernik is a Christian. Also, many conservative Christians like Tebow do work that is not credited to thim in this peace. That said, to often the two things get split when the should not.

    1. What makes you doubt Kaepernick’s profession of faith? This is an honest question I’m inviting you to ask yourself.

      Your comment that you don’t know that he’s a Christian confirms, for me, what Mike Frost is writing about here.

      Did you take a moment to learn about Colin before you questioned whether he fits your definition of what it means to follow Jesus? Here’s a little snippet from Wikipedia in case you didn’t: “Kaepernick was baptized Methodist, confirmed Lutheran, and attended a Baptist church during his college years. Kaepernick spoke about his faith saying, “My faith is the basis from where my game comes from. I’ve been very blessed to have the talent to play the game that I do and be successful at it. I think God guides me through every day and helps me take the right steps and has helped me to get to where I’m at. When I step on the field, I always say a prayer, say I am thankful to be able to wake up that morning and go out there and try to glorify the Lord with what I do on the field. I think if you go out and try to do that, no matter what you do on the field, you can be happy about what you did.” Kaepernick has multiple tattoos. His right arm features a scroll with the Bible verse Psalm 18:39 written on it. Tattooed under the scroll are praying hands with the phrase “To God The Glory” written on them. To the left of both the scroll and praying hands is the word “Faith” written vertically. His left arm features a Christian cross with the words “Heaven Sent” on it referring to Jesus. Written above and below the cross is the phrase “God Will Guide Me”. Written to the left and right of the cross is the Bible verse Psalm 27:3. His chest features the phrase “Against All Odds” and artwork around it that represents “inner strength, spiritual growth, and humility”. His back features a mural of angels against demons.”

      1. The author posits that Kaepernick is somehow offering a different facet of Christianity than Tebow does, and offers as proof his tattoos, and his charitable works. The problem is that Kaepernick’s kneeling is actually an act of civil disobedience, not praying – and the “Christian acts” that the author offers to the reader are actually considered by many to be “public relations”, seeking to manage his image and counter negative publicity in the hope to retain a shot at a job elsewhere in the league.

        Covering your body with tattoos doesn’t make someone a Christian. Being born Methodist, confirmed Lutheran and attending Baptist services doesn’t make someone a Christian. A self serving statement to a newspaper doesn’t make someone a Christian.

        Is Kaepernick a Christian? I have no idea… but if the author wants to use him as foil in pushing his perspective, he should have chosen someone less ambiguous or he should have made a better case.

  39. Interesting. Although Christ followers exist somewhere in the middle (or are able to find the truth at both ends) of this dichotomy, there does seem to be a division…one that I’ve experienced personally with fellow believers in my own life. I would argue, however, that political activism is strong on both sides. Franklin Graham is pretty political, probably even more so recently due to the presidential election. It seems that “side” which people associate with evangelical Christianity has generally been increasingly pretty active politically. I think that’s one reason why we’re seeing this dichotomy. What do you think?

  40. Well after reading the lengthy sanctimonious debate, two things seem clear: Christians love to hear themselves talk. Mike is right about divisions.

  41. […] along the same fault lines as many of the national racial controversies currently making headlines. In a stunning post last May, Christian author Michael Frost wrote about the two different Christian cultures reflected in […]

  42. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  43. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  44. […] Michael Frost est le directeur adjoint de Morling College à Sydney. Un conférencier populaire à travers le monde, il a écrit plus d'une douzaine de livres, y compris "The Shaping of Things to Come", "Exiles", "The Road to Missional" et "Incarnate". Cette pièce a été publiée à l'origine Le blog de Frost . […]

  45. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  46. From what I’ve seen and heard from many across the Christian faith, the issue isn’t so much that Kaepernick is protesting. It is the means by which he is doing so. He is bringing light to an issue that needs to be addressed, and that is a very good thing that most support. He is placing the emphasis on one group (racial minorities) that needs it, but, unfortunately, the perspective of most that oppose the movement believes that he is doing so by alienating another group that also needs the attention (military veterans that fought for our nation and all that the flag represents). Whether it was intentional or not I don’t know (I seriously doubt it was), but the issue isn’t that he is protesting against racial inequality, but the divisive message against those veterans that is portrayed in that protest.

    1. I’m an OEF/OIF Marine. Colin in no way offends me. The only people bitching it disrespects me & people like me are civilians…. because people like me fought for EVERYONE to have 1A Rights not only some or only those I agree with.

  47. Michael Frost, after reading this story it left me feeling that you feel Kaepernick’s style of worship/philanthropy is not quite up to snuff or a little course or unrefined?? I am sure that is not what you meant to do, but that was what I was left feeling.

  48. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  49. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  50. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  51. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  52. This biased puff piece was just re-printed on WaPo, so I thought I’d comment here rather than there.

    First – as an observation – I find it interesting that an Australian has such strong opinions on this matter. As a dual citizen of both countries, it amuses me that Australians feel free to comment on any all American issues as if they actually had knowledge, depth of understanding and a real perspective to offer. But, interestingly, when Americans comment on Australian issues, they are derided as overstepping, being high handed and seeking to force American perspectives on the world. Just an observation, based on my experience in both cultures.

    Secondly – I noticed in this biased piece of yours, you ignore – or at the very least gloss over – many facts related to Tim Tebow’s Christianity.

    You ignore:

    The fact that Tim didn’t pray DURING the National Anthem, but on the sidelines by himself and for himself, AFTER the National Anthem.

    The mocking and the hate that Tim received for his praying, and that the ridicule was more for being a Christian, as opposed to the the act of getting on his knees.

    That Tim’s praying was NOT accepted or embraced by most, but ridiculed – by fans, other teams, the political left and even the mainstream media.

    That Colin DIDN’T actually pray, but merely took a knee to protest. Its easy to dress it up as a Christian act after the fact, but it wasn’t presented as such until it became a convenient talking point. You instead seem to imply that the act of praying and an act of civil disobedience are somehow the same thing. They’re not.

    Finally – and most glaringly – you also don’t mention the Tebow Cure Hospital in the Philippines, the various ‘Night to Shine’ programs for people with special needs around the world, Timmy’s Playroom which have built around the world in Children’s hospitals, his W15H program, his Orphan Care program and a number of things that the Tim Tebow Foundation does… while you spend a significant amount of time discussing all that Colin Kaepernick has done.

    I don’t fault Colin for his philanthropy – I congratulate him on it. It would be nice if – when you are writing an article that starts with ‘Colin Kaepernick vs. Tim Tebow’, you could actually be bothered to compare apples to apples throughout the article, and not omit facts just because they help you push some agenda. And give some credit where credit is due as well. Instead of leaving your readers with the impression that one (Colin) has hidden depths while hiding the other’s (Tim’s) good work. Not a very Christian act, Mr. Frost.

  53. Tebow was not kneeling in “private prayer.” He was kneeling in public prayer.

    “When you pray, you shall not be as the hypocrites, for
    they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and in the
    corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men. Most
    certainly, I tell you, they have received their reward.”

    Matthew 6:5

  54. Tebow kneels in very PUBLIC prayer. He is making a public statement with his “prayer,”
    perhaps in ignorance of his Lord’s admonition—Mat. 6:6?: “And when thou prayest,
    thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray . . . that they
    may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But thou,
    when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut the door,
    pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret
    shall reward thee openly.”

  55. A respectful reminder that women have had a major impact on Christianity (beyond giving birth to future NFL quarterbacks) for over 2000 years. The duality you’ve outlined in this article misses a much more complex evolution (revolution?) of faith currently under way because it only looks at two camps identifying with two specific male sports figures. As an editor, I understand that this is what you set out to do in writing this–and you do shed some good light on the top layer of what’s happening. But, if I were your editor, I would ask you to go deeper. If you look beyond the two camps you’ve set up you’ll see that there’s a much bigger transformation at the root of this dynamic.

  56. Why do you describe abortion as a “moral issue” and a “private sin”? You make the killing of human beings who inconvenience those who created them sound like watching porn. Do you ignore the science of embryology and insist abortion is morally equivalent to cursing? It’s hard to take any Christian seriously who thinks so little of preborn life.

  57. Interesting perspective. It is of note that the Scriptures speak of a great “apostasy” that will happen in the last days. Presently, we have a Pope who openly states that a personal relationship with Christ is not necessary and is, in fact, dangerous. You have both Catholic and Protestant churches holding to the idea that God accepts all viewpoints and that we are all “God’s Children” and we’re all accepted in His eyes just as we are. Half of Christianity in these last days holds to the gospel of affirmation rather than the gospel of transformation. Half of Christianity in these last days believes they can hold our governmental leadership in contempt and they can go out and openly protest against law enforcement authorities with political activism (which is an interesting read of Romans 13) and they can hold those bigoted “Christian evangelicals” in contempt because they preach against unity with their upholding of the rights of the unborn and because they stand with the Scriptures in regards to personal sin and the need for repentance. It is the Christian evangelical that admonishes men and women everywhere to repent from such things as fornication, adultery, alcoholism, substance abuse, spousal abuse, sexual perversion, and homosexuality and sexual deviance in all forms- and to seek redemption and forgiveness through a personal, life-changing relationship with Jesus Christ. It is the Christian evangelical who puts personal holiness ahead of political activism- and rightly so, since the need for personal holiness IS addressed in Scripture and the requirement for political activism IS NOT.

    It is the Christian evangelical who understands that if the Word of God and sound doctrine does not inform ones’ worldview, life experiences, and politics- then ones’ politics, life experiences, and worldview will seduce a person into believing lies about Gods’ Word and it will lead them into false doctrine. So yes, I sincerely do believe there are two camps of Christianity in the world today. There will be many who stand up in judgment who will say “what about all we did for you, Jesus? What about our political activism? We protested governmental corruption and stood against that horrible President! We supported (read: played into the hypocrisy of) the Black Lives Matter movement! We fought against racism and sexual discrimination in Your Name! We upheld all people as equal in the your eyes- despite their sexual orientation because, after all, YOU made us all this way!” And you know what He’s going to say to them, right? Does anyone really need a refresher on what the Scriptures say in this regard?

    So yes, I believe there are two Christianities in America in these last days. Some Christians have oil in their lamps- whereas others some seem to have nothing but vitriol in theirs. When The Bridegroom calls and it is time for those lamps to be trimmed- that’s when the issue of who has His Oil and who does not is going to be of utmost importance.

    1. Way too much preaching here. What it comes down to Tebow didn’t knee during the National Anthem and Colin did. A slap in the face to all the soldiers dead or still alive. Fight your cause a different way.

      1. I am a Marine. I’m an OEF/OIF Marine veteran. I am in no way offended by Colin. I fought for everyone to have 1A Rights not only some or only the ones I agree with. I don’t give a rat’s ass if he kneels sits lays down idgaf. What about paralyzed people? They can’t stand either but I don’t see you attacking them because why? Because it’s not socially acceptable to attack the disabled. However, per your comment & so many others like yourself, you can see it’s socially acceptable to use my name & my person to attack someone for being black & aware of black cultural issues. People like you disgust me. Don’t commit racism in my name. Marines are inclusive of anyone who can make the cut. We don’t give a shit what color you are or your gender. Stop committing racism in my name!!!!

        Signed,
        Devil Dawg
        US Marine OEF/OIF

    2. Wow. We see things so differently. You do realize, don’t you, that the parable in Matthew 25 you are referencing is a stronger case for the call to be a church “doing” for the least of these than to being a church wrapped up in personal piety? It’s a throwback to the sermon on the mount (5-7) – his first public address in Matthew’s gospel – which lays out the mission of the reign of heaven to gather a community of justice, beginning with the marginalized and oppressed. It ends with verses similar to the Matt25 parable “not everyone who says to me ‘lord, lord” will enter the reign of heaven, but only they who do the will of my father” (which Jesus just spent 3 chapters laying out for his followers.

      I wish you only the best, and we clearly embody the different “christianities” articulated in the article, but I find your assertion that Matthew’s gospel – and the parable in chapter 25 in particular – supports a personal relationship with a personal savior and a commitment to personal piety and righteousness over a commitment to the way of the cross that stands against empire, oppression, and violence particularly surprising and troubling. At the very least, consider where someone like me is coming from. And before you condemn me to your version of eternal hell and damnation, consider that it is deeply and firmly rooted in the way of Christ and in scripture.

      1. Don’t entertain that crazy fool. He doesn’t even know what his own Bible says. How are you going to have a meaningful debate with an ignorant know it all?

  58. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  59. It is extremely frustrating and bias for this author to leave out the fact that Tim Tebow has had a full fledged charitable foundation for almost a decade. It also neglects to mention the media outrage when he began kneeling years ago and how everyone said it was not the place on the field for him to kneel. That is documented fact that the media was very against his kneeling. If author is going to present an argument then he needs to mention ALL the facts. Tim Tebow been affecting social change for years with his foundation. How do u leave that out of a comparison article?

    1. No it wasn’t not once in the NFL was it ever a problem for Tebow to kneel. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. If Tebow gets to do it then Colin does too. Bottom line end of story period.

  60. […] Shaping of Things to Come,” and “Exiles.” This piece was originally posted on his blog, and is published here with […]

  61. There are no racial issues in the world.

    Only hate vs love issues, oppression vs freedom issues, darkness vs light issues and lies vs The Truth issues.

    This is an old war still being waged on many fronts with the oppressor changing his costumes and tactics over time as he recruits whoever is blindly willing to allow themselves to be used.

    Anyway, The Truth has, is and will always win- from beginning to the end.

    Which side are you standing on and are you sure it’s the right one?

  62. The author need not have written the article, except to provide a vehicle for the comments section, which more concretely make his point.

  63. I appreciate your piece. As an adoptive father, however, I have one request: please edit your line about Colin’s birth and adoption placement. Instead of saying the birth mother “gave up for adoption” please use “placed for adoption” or “decided on an adoption plan.” The former implies an “unwanting” and is wrought with painful negativity, especially towards the child placed/adopted. The latter is the generally preferred language for birth families, adoptive families, and agencies who facilitate such placements. It’s a nuance, but it’s important. Thank you.

  64. You have certainly stirred the kettle, Mr. Frost!

    I don’t recall how I got here, attracted, I think, by the false dichotomy in your teaser: The notion that Tebow’s kneeling is private prayer while Kaepernick’s is public protest.

    It is fascinating to witness those who have the temerity to call themselves Christians judge the content & value of others’ prayer.

    1. Let’s face it. Colin has every right to voice his opinion. But the way he does it is crazy. Big difference between him and Tebow. He promotes hate for one thing. Why else would he wear socks of pigs that look like the men and women of our police forces?? Shouldn’t have

      1. Really Richard I’d love to see his “pig” socks….

  65. […] Michael Frost is the vice principal of Morling College in Sydney. A popular speaker around the world, he has written more than a dozen books, including “The Shaping of Things to Come,” “Exiles,” “The Road to Missional” and “Incarnate.” This piece was originally published on Frost’s blog. […]

  66. Did Tim Tebow take a knee DURING the playing of the National Anthem? If so, his action in not fundamentally different from Kaepernick’s. Point: He would have been refusing to stand DURING the playing of the National Anthem in order to express a belief. Neither man disrupted the National Anthem. Both men have that right.

  67. Thank you for showing the hypocrisy. If they’re Christians; don’t they all worship the same God? But somehow they can’t acknowledge serious issues that really are occurring under their same God? It’s because Tebow is white. The same reason they always pick me to do media on. I have blonde hair & blue eyes & I’m kind of pale even with a tan. I’m considered a “classic beauty akin to the likes of Marylin Monroe” (that was an actual quote used about me) I routinely get picked over minorities because I bring in more money. That’s what it boils down to- money. If the NFL was smart, they would have done what Nike did. Nike’s profit shot thru the roof with a 30+% profit increase. The NFL picked the wrong side. They think only white men have money to spend except here comes Nike backing Colin & smash profit records. The NFL forgets that the NFL is mostly black. They lost profits because they improperly gauged who their audience was then they improperly gauged why they lost money. They lost money because they (NFL) refuses to acknowledge they’re a black organization that refuses to acknowledge black issues in the community. So, basically the NFL wants to pay black men to “entertain” white men… isn’t that all backwards? They spent time finding good black players. They fill the NFL with mostly black men but then want to tell those men stfu because we don’t care about your community? We only care about the community sitting in the stands. The ones that already came up out of poverty mostly using their white privilege to get ahead while refusing to acknowledge white privilege is really a thing- how they can’t see it while sitting in the stands baffles me, but then again racism baffles me too. I don’t judge on skin color. I don’t even judge by what they say; I judge by what they do- their actions. When it comes down to it, it’s the deplorables. There’s a reason DT & his ilk are called deplorables. You’ve seen the madman known as Captain Orangutan in the White House…. I don’t need to explain more because DT takes it all. He is the epitome of everything trashy & classless within the Tea Party. He’s the epitome of racism misogyny- hate. His heart is full of hate. That’s the bottom line. Unlike Obama who united us as a people, he (DT) intentionally divides us & fills his side with hate. The only way he knows to “lead” (he’s no leader BTW) is thru fear. I’m on my knees praying every single day for this ordeal to come to an end already. Once that piece of orange trash is out of my house, then we as a country can start to heal & recover from the criminal who stole the office. Then people like Colin can start to live in peace. We’ll still have the deplorables crying in the corner about the criminal who got away… that’s how backwards they are- they would rather keep a bondafide criminal in office than a country & government that makes it. && now you see why it was so easy to trick the deplorables into voting for him. They actually believe him Their stupidly astounds me, but it also brings me back to this is how Colin got into this mess. Deplorables think all blacks are criminals. They’re getting what they deserved. They shouldn’t have bucked police…. etc etc etc you’ve heard all the racist lines before. Ultimately deplorables are scared of blacks & think if blacks don’t want to die by cop leave our country. Why should we try to make life better for you you don’t belong here…. deplorables are like DT 100% fake. They care about their white issues while not realizing blacks are in the same boat. Under DT I saw the rise of the KKK. Dudes I’m from the DEEP SOUTH. I know racism. I’ve NEVER seen a robed KKK member until DT praised the KKK. Then I saw them IRL up close & personal. Heather could have been me. DT & Colin started all this. Colin was the one with the courage to stand up & take Captain Orangutan on. DT has made racism a Republican thing. The GOP has lost a lot of voters to democrats & democracy. Even the republicans are turning on DT. Nobody wants him around anymore. You’re going to see him get impeached. He’s going to jail & he knows it. Mueller intentionally took each one of DTs staff down 1 by 1 progressively up the ladder. Kush & DT Jr are next. Then DT himself. It’s all part of the game to keep DT unhinged. He can’t even be an effective POTUS because he’s too busy worrying about Mueller coming for him- which he is but we have to keep Kavanaugh out. Kavanaugh is DT’s personal lawyer. His firm started out handling all of DTs criminals. Then one by one every single one of them turned on DT. So now DT is trying to get someone confirmed who thinks a POTUS can never be indicted. He will protect DT & he’s already on DTs payroll but sure let’s confirm him DT is 100% immoral nothing of substance & a full blown sociopath possibly psychopath. This is what happens when you willfully elect criminals. It literally effects every single aspect of our lives…. just ask Colin.

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